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New scope: Leupold VX-3 or Swarovski AV |
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mwyates
Optics Master Joined: June/15/2004 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 1196 |
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On his .308 any decent scope should hold up, so, as Ilya and I discussed in another thread, durability is not an issue. The Swaro has better optics, as it should. But, he asked about VX-3's not VX-III's, so the optical difference would be less (I really wish Leupold had changed the name more dramatically than III to 3; they are much better marketers than that). Get whichever one you want to spend the money for; you'll love it.
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No man on his deathbed ever said "I wish I'd made more money".
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OHE
Optics GrassHopper Joined: February/15/2009 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 6 |
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I'd go for the Leupold. The latest VX-3 feature Diamond Coat Coatings which are 15X harder than conventional coatings. That means won't you have the problem of very slow degradation of the scopes coatings due to ordinary cleaning, and, above all, if you must use your shirt tail to quickly clean the lenses in the field, you don't have to worry about scratching them.
They new VX-3's feature the same lenses and coatings that the very well recieved VX-7 has, their Xtended Twilight Lense System.
They are much cheaper than the Swaro AV's. The prices I've seen for the Leupold VX-3 in that size are about $580. The Swaro AV you are looking at is listed at about $990.
It's been my experience that Leupolds have much larger eye boxes than their competition. In their VX-7 line, Leupold claims 67% more EB at the lower magnifications, and a whopping 137% more at their higher magnifications than the competition.
Leupolds have the rep as being tough and reliable. Their VX-3 have the next generation inert gas mix, Argon and Krypton. The are all, even the cheapest Rifleman scopes, recoil tested at 750 g's for 5000 times. That's the equivalent of a .375 H7H's recoil. I've never heard of any of the Swarovskis being recoil tested at all. OHE
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Jon A
Optics Journeyman Joined: March/14/2008 Location: Everett, WA Status: Offline Points: 670 |
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That's funny, I didn't think they even made record players anymore. And yet I keep hearing this broken record.....
E, do you really believe the fact that you've never heard of it is plausible evidence that Swarovski does no recoil testing? Do their Engineers over there typically keep in close contact with you, informing you of their day to day activities? I like the new screen name BTW. |
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Roy Finn
MODERATOR Steiner Junkie Joined: April/05/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4856 |
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Only had to read the first sentence to recognize a Eremicus post.
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13182 |
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Some thing never change, I suppose.
E still talks about things he has no knowledge of. For the benefit of other people on this thread, I just want to point out that E has never seen or used Swaro AV. He has also never seen or used the new Leupold VX-3. As a general observation he has no idea how abrasive or fragile a typical lens coating is, nor does he have any clue on which coating Leupold marketing people compared the DamondCoat to. While new to this forum, E has posted the same illegible BS all over the forums in the past. ILya |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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Roy Finn
MODERATOR Steiner Junkie Joined: April/05/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4856 |
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Why doesn't Leupold have their own forum like some other manufacturers do. It would be a great place for "like minds" to hand out.
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Horsemany
Optics Journeyman Joined: February/28/2008 Location: Nebraska Status: Offline Points: 643 |
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That's why I stay out of "the fire". I don't like all the bickering and B.S. Here's to new beginnings. |
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13182 |
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illegible. |
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Horsemany
Optics Journeyman Joined: February/28/2008 Location: Nebraska Status: Offline Points: 643 |
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It is also rumored the "Damondcoat" ILya speaks of was developed by Matt Damon. Just pokin ILya. You must have been a little flustered when you wrote that post.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Duck!!!!! Incoming!!!!!!
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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OHE
Optics GrassHopper Joined: February/15/2009 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 6 |
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Youy are quite right Koshkin. I've never handled either. But I do have a new FX-3 on order. That decision was based on lots of experience with the M8 6X42 and the trust I have in Leupold products. Not because I'd handled one or put it through it's paces. They have yet to let me down.
You are quite right that I can't tell someone just how soft any coatings are or how they compare. But I'm sure you can. Have you ever tested Leupold's claims that their Diamond Coat Coatings are 15X harder than conventional coatings ? Please tell us what you found.
I do know that conventional coatings are easily scratched and damaged. I think we can all agree on that. So, wouldn't anything that is significantly harder be nice to have on a hunting scope ?
Diamond Coat Coatings have been around for quite a while. I have yet to see anyone show where Leupold's claim for them are not true or exagerated.
How about recoil or impact testing by Swarovski of their scopes ? Any word about that ?
We keep hearing how Swarovskis are "better optically." Well, when I can see .30 bullet holes at 200 yds. on 6X or the same bullet holes at 300 yds. on 10X, I'd say that's plenty. I get that from my Leupolds.
As to low light performance, I watched a very small forked horn buck on a pretty dark, clear, but moonless night once at about 150 yds. So dark I couldn't use more than 6.5X on my 6.5-20X40AO Leupold scope or it would black out, show me nothing. Yet, in spite of the extra lenses from AO and the variable, I was able to pick out his tiny forks as he mingled among the does. That sure impressed me. Legal light had been long gone by then.
Say what you want about each. I'll take the Leupold for the reasons I've stated. E
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13182 |
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I can't really put you in ignore on this forum, since I am the moderator here. I will address your post this time, and we'll see how it goes from here. My comments are in read:
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Horsemany
Optics Journeyman Joined: February/28/2008 Location: Nebraska Status: Offline Points: 643 |
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That pretty well sums it up ILya. The only flaw I'm seeing is the coatings. It would seem without having tested coatings, it holds no validity to dispute Leupold's claims. It may very well be B.S. However it may very well be true. THe fact Leupold offers no details of what coating it was compared to doesn not by default make the claims "hogwash" IMO. |
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13182 |
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It makes E's claim that Leupold's coating is more scratch resistant than Swaro or Zeiss or Nightforce or any other coating absolute hogwash. ILya |
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Jon A
Optics Journeyman Joined: March/14/2008 Location: Everett, WA Status: Offline Points: 670 |
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It does. He's not saying it is necessarily untrue, simply that it means nothing useful. Edited by Jon A - February/15/2009 at 17:35 |
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Horsemany
Optics Journeyman Joined: February/28/2008 Location: Nebraska Status: Offline Points: 643 |
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Oh. I guess I didn't read that far into it. I took the word hogwash to mean B.S.
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13182 |
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Those claims are an absolutely classic example of misleading advertising. Without defining a reference, they mean nothing. There is no such thing as a "conventional" coating. Every company uses coatings that are a little bit different. Hence Leupold's claim of their Diamond Coat being harder than a "conventional" coating is both hogwash and BS. ILya |
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