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Saw a Super Sniper made by Nikko Stirling |
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13182 |
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I have never seen the Nikko Sniper scope you are referring to. I have no idea whether it is a good scope or not, so I can not comment on that.
However, earlier in this thread someone said that they are made/inspected by Asia Optical. If that is the case than the SWFA Super Sniper (formerly Tasco Super Sniper) is a different scope since it is not made by Asia Optical. That is a fact. ILya |
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wcat
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/14/2006 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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Thanks a lot for these infos! It actually measure up to what I could see since I (now) have the scope in my hands. It concur too with other infos I could find on the 'net where the Nikko Sniper 10x42 was sold some years back. Wcat |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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OK...... Here's the poop. I have tried to not say this as I have no experience with that scope. IT IS NOT the same as the Super Sniper. I can be almost 100% sure that it will not be as good as a Super Sniper. (Tasco or SWFA) Yes Tasco did get a bad reputation for a while, some of it was deserved. They did however make some very good scopes. The Super Sniper was one of them. This is exactly why SWFA purchased the rights for that scope. Too many people want to try and lump them in with other scopes that were made in Asia, whether it was Japan, the Phillipines or China. I can not attest to the durability of those other scopes, which by the way are entirely too close in resemblance to suggest anything other than being a "copycat" They as Koshkin has pointed out are not made by the same people. I also have serious doubts that they are built to anywhere near the same standards as the Super Sniper.
If anyone here other than SWFA or Koshkin (because he is the optics guru here) were to have said that. I suspect (given the tone in this thread) the next question was going to be. "Yeah Well where are the Super Snipers made then?" That question was going to come up, I know it. That is a question which I will not answer. Not because I can't. More so because, this site is owned by SWFA, and I find it impolite to give away the origin, or manufacturer of their scope.
Now RedRover, I was deliberately trying to avoid a flame war, which if you were to have done some searching for the answers, you would have found the truth about manufacture for the above mentioned scopes. You would have found that they are different. You would then have not had to hear it here, and thus be suspicious of the answer. It isn't a matter of superiority. More so, that if anyone were to give you the answer, you would not believe it. Your comments of "If any" and "Even if they are true" only reinforce that my suspicion is well founded.
I'll cut to the chase since you won't actually do the homework.
The SWFA and Tasco SuperSnipers are, and were very tough, and very well built scopes. They represent what is likely the very best value for the money spent. They are "Crazy Tough" and "Nothing else comes close." So yes, the simialarities are a direct attempt at "copy catting."
I'm not saying that the Nikko isn't a decent scope. It may well be. I will say though, that the attempt to mimick the SS by other companies is a testament to the fact that they recognize a superior product and are, or were trying to cash in on the success of another companies product. Also that by not trying to make theirs as different as was possible, there was no attempt on their part other than trying to cash in on anothers merits.
You probably won't like hearing it, but face it. The truth often hurts. I wanted to avoid being a part of that. Which is another reason for wanting you to research. But, given your adamant tone. I couldn't really care less.
Now...For the others..
This link is to a post which is an example as to why there so many questions, compared to facts.
This link is exactly why no one here is going to say "Where" It also tells exactly why there's a dispute due to a manufacturer making false claims. It comes from the host of this fine forum.
Now this is quite enough (factual) info, but feel free to research all you want. Just know that having half the story, or making assumptions isn't fact finding.
And RedRover...........Next time you feel the need to "Piss" on someones shoes............Drink more water first.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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wcat
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/14/2006 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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Some Pics (Everybody likes pics):
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rifle looney
Optics Master Joined: November/21/2008 Status: Offline Points: 2553 |
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thank you for the pics the gun is nice, but the scope is still a..... NIKKO sterling? I'm sure it will serve you well until you compare it with a real Super Sniper side by side.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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It is a good looking set up. You like the Hogue stock?
I'm sure that the Nikko being Japanese made is atleast an OK scope. Hopefully it will serve you well.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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wcat
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/14/2006 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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Thanks, I'd say it's the best of the cheap stocks, much better than the stock Rem SPS Varmint stock...for the same price.
Thanks |
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dav619
Optics GrassHopper Joined: February/13/2009 Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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It not a mimick or copy, simply that the 'product' was never exclusive to any one buyer. Ive listed 5 different buyers in my previous post that have marketed these over the years. Those are just the ones that I know of.
It still isn't exclusive to SWFA as Edgar Brother's have marketed the 'product' in the UK for years and they continue to do so today. Currently I think they only offer it in 10x42 side parallax (10x42M) form, but in the past I have owned a 20x42 from them also.
I'll stand by my ealier post. Having used both a recent Edgar Brothers 10x42 and recent (SWFA sourced) Super Sniper 10x42M, side by side, I can confirm they are identical in the following departments: exterior finish and quality of, optical standard, weight.
Its totally possible that one buyer specifies a different inspection standard than they other buyer. Its also possible that one uses different materials and internals to the other, in this case though they did a great job to keep the weights exactly the same.
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RedRover
Optics GrassHopper Joined: October/30/2004 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 6 |
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Cyborg: The material in the links you have posted does absolutely NOTHING to address my question of the differences – if any – between the Tasco Super Sniper and the Nikko Stirling Sniper. Doesn’t even MENTION the latter! If what is stated about the Tasco scopes in the article by David Fortier in TacticalGunFan is correct, it brings up some serious questions about them, even though the chronology is very vague. Quote: “Not a commercial product, it was originally developed for military use by Tasco in answer to a Request for Procurement made by the US Navy in the 1980s.” So I guess that means that it could have been originally developed any time between 1980 and 1989. Quote: “A few years went by and a small, family owned business that specialized in optics (SWFA Inc.) managed to buy a small quantity of these scopes on closeout. The scopes were an overrun from the Navy contract, and the price was excellent, so SWFA scooped them up and sold them on the A few years from when? The above statements could mean it was anywhere from about the mid 1980s to the early to mid 1990s when SWFA were selling the original lot of ‘over-run’ scopes. Quote: “These early scopes garnered an excellent reputation and sold quickly, so SWFA approached Tasco about continuing production, but at the closeout price. A deal was struck and Tasco tooled up. Unfortunately, many of these later scopes weren't of the same quality as the earlier Navy overruns. The model soon earned a bad reputation, and Tasco eventually went out of business.” Quote: “The scopes themselves are made in a small plant in It’s not clear from this how many manufacturers have been involved in the production of the Tasco/SWFA scopes, from the original navy contract ones to the present. One? Two? Three? If Fortier is to be believed (and you, Cyborg, are holding his article up as an authoritative reference on the subject) then from somewhere between the mid 1980s and the mid 1990s, through to 2003 when the Tasco company went belly up, they were selling SS scopes of variable quality and with a generally poor reputation. The Nikko Stirling Sniper scopes appeared on the market in the mid 1990s, and garnered a fairly good reputation amongst ‘F’ class target shooters in the But to quote from some of your earlier posts: Tasco had a few military contracts. I'm unsure if I have tried to not say this as I have no experience with that scope. IT IS NOT the same as the Super Sniper. I can be almost 100% sure that it will not be as good as a Super Sniper. (Tasco or SWFA) The SWFA and Tasco SuperSnipers are, and were very tough, and very well built scopes. They represent what is likely the very best value for the money spent. They are "Crazy Tough" and "Nothing else comes close." Just know that having half the story, or making assumptions isn't fact finding. You should take this last one on board for yourself!!!!!
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rifle looney
Optics Master Joined: November/21/2008 Status: Offline Points: 2553 |
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And for all your effort this did or proved what for you. You are the one whom made it a pissing contest. and no one has gained any thing here.......GOODBYE...rover
Edited by rifle looney - February/15/2009 at 09:58 |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Neither the Tasco, nor the SWFA was or is made by HAKKO. The others are made by Asia Optical, and Hakko. The SS is not, nor was it made by them. It is and has been made by the same company and in the same plant then as it is now. This comes directly from the very person that now owns the brand. They were the first, so anything else is a "copy cat"
I'm not going to say that a "copy cat" won't also be a good scope. As I have said before, they may well be. I am saying though that the first introduction of the SS was a great scope. I am also saying that the present production is even better than the originals were.
Why so many want to claim that something else is built in the same plant as the SS, when it comes from the owners that they are not, is totally beyond me.
Even if they were, they still would not be the same scopes. It is clear that Barska and Zeiss aren't made in the same plant. But for arguments sake say that they were, would that then make Barska Zeiss equal? The answer would be a resounding NO. Why would that be? Because Zeiss would make damned sure that the proprietary elements used for the construction of their scopes was protected. This is what SMART comapnies do to protect their share of the market. The point is MOOT but none the less a valid point, as you seem to think that an argument for them being from the same plant would then make them the equal, regardless of the fact that they are not from the same plant.
What are you trying to push across as fact? Better yet, why? There is nothing to be gained in doing so. You want to dismiss everything presented to you, but offer only speculation. What I posted are only a very small fragment of what can easily be found, you have to READ and COMPREHEND what has been posted in a number of places. Then you must take that which is factual and use it to dismiss what isn't. Most of what is out there is purely speculation, and has no authenticity. You don't care about any of that though, you are looking for a pissing contest. Despite your claims of having no interest in my urinary system.
(That's a funny line by the way, atleast I thought so anyway )
Just what exactly is your interest in my "urinary system" outside of the fact that mine does work very well. Your stream seems a tad bit weak. Drink plenty of fluids, and come back in a few days with real honest facts and not specualtive conjecture based on time lines and assumptions.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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dav619...... First welcome to Optics Talk. Second, It is from Chris Farris himself that the SWFA SS is and has been made in the same plant as was in it's conception. To continue suggesting anything else to try and garner weight for other products is calling him a liar. This site is owned and operated by SWFA. Chris is a close and dear friend of mine. I will not, nor will anyone else simply allow such adamant speculation to continue here. If you wish to continue in your assumptive demands. You may feel free to do so else where. I won't allow it to continue here. RedRover this goes for you as well.
Edited by cyborg - February/15/2009 at 12:21 |
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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dav619
Optics GrassHopper Joined: February/13/2009 Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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I havent called anybody a liar.
I am aware of who operates this forum.
This is clearly not speculation, even so much as a quick google of the brand names I have mentioned will more than validate this.
I think a documented side by side comparision (with pics) might be in order.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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A quick google does as anyone wants based on conjecture, and opinions of the ones that write what you find. Read the link that goes to this forum, and what Chris Farris has said.
Again he is the ONE that knows. It is also known that the SS is not made by Hakko, nor is it made by Asis Optical as the others are. It is also known that there are Marketers out there trying to insist that the SS is made by the same as the product that they are trying to sell.
Since it is the stance of this forums host, that these calims are illegitimate. Then any claim to the contrary is the same as calling them liars.
And yes, these claims ARE speculation.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13182 |
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Gentlemen, let's cool things down a touch.
I will not address which scope is better or worse since I have not seen them all. Here are a few things that are coming off as fact: Nikko Sniper scope is made by Asia Optical, right? That virtually guarantees that it is not made by the same people as the Super Sniper. This Edgar Brothers scope you refer to, where is it made? All accounts that I have seen indicate that ti was made by Hakko (Hakko did indeed make a Super Sniper look alike scope for some time). As for the Lynx 10x42, the current version clearly has no relation to the Super Sniper. I am pretty sure they marketed a SUper SNiper look alike scope, but I do not know who made it. Here is the one thing I know with a great deal of certainty: Tasco/SWFA was never made by either Hakko (now called Japan Optic Limited, by the way) or Asia Optical. If the scopes you refer to, were made by either Hakko or Asia Optical, then Super Sniper is NOT the same scope. ILya |
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rifle looney
Optics Master Joined: November/21/2008 Status: Offline Points: 2553 |
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I once came across a SS made by Chevrolet ....traded it for a Gateway branded one??????......WTF........ this is stupid. put it too rest. please!
Edited by rifle looney - February/15/2009 at 17:21 |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Ilya..........You and I know.........But regardless of what we continue to preach, they will not get it, and they have no desire to truly hunt facts. I suspect that they want to know where the SS is made. Chris has mentioned that he wants that to remain proprietary info. We do know according to the inspection sticker on the SS, and that it isn't where these others are being made.
I am unclear as to why they want to insist that they are the same scopes when it is truly not the case. As such I am very suspicious as to their motives.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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dav619
Optics GrassHopper Joined: February/13/2009 Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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The inspection sticker on the EB Sniper 10x42 states Kenko Optics Japan.
The original Lynx 10x42 mirrors the EB.
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moosetrax
Optics GrassHopper Joined: February/15/2009 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 11 |
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I say if it looks like a duck, talks like a duck, and walks like a duck, it's probably a chicken in a costume and the only way you'll ever know is to kill it. My 16x duck came from SWFA and from what I know, there are alot of turrets that look like them, eye pieces focus + and - most are even numbered the same, you know 1 to 14. Yes, I can see the argument that they might all be the same... |
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moosetrax
Optics GrassHopper Joined: February/15/2009 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 11 |
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Maybe they really are super snipers. I wrote my name on another kids science project once and said I made it.
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