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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 16:51
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was wondering if a marlin 30-30 would be enough for elk and at what distance, my nephew will be going with me on a elk hunt in 09 and he recently bought that rifleI know its a good deer gun but not sure about anything bigger.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 16:54
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i will tell you yes inside 100yds, and im sure some people here will disagree with me
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 17:02
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Wouldn't it depend n how far you planned on tracking it after the shot?  Wink

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 17:05
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It would not be the first time an elk was hunted with a 30-30, but my personal feeling is that it is not enough gun. I say this mainly because elk are hunted in teretory where Bears live and if you should need to defend yourself form a large Bear interested in taking  your Elk for his own dinner the 30-30 simply is not enough gun to stop him.   A 30-06 is the absolute minimum for Bears and a  heavier gun like a 300 wsm, 300 win mag is a little better and a 338 win mag or 375 H&H is about perfect.  For a 30-30 with iron sights we are talking 100 yds max for an elk and I wouldnt want to attempt anything further than 150 yds with a low power scope on a 30-30.  If it was a matter of survival I would press it out farther but this is a planned hunt and a 30-06 or heavier gun just makes more sense.
I have killed several deer with a 30-30 and all but one have run at least 50 yds the one that didn't was a head shot. An Elk is much larger than a deer and the likelyhood that you will only wound the animal is highly probable with a 30-30.  As far as lever guns go the 45-70 would be a fine choice as would a 450 marlin -  neither is a long range gun - best at under 150 yds but very deadly and ideal for self defense against a bear or mountain lion.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 17:11
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http://www.buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#30-30
Comming Soon Buffalo Bore 30-30 ammo  190 gr JFN 
this is the bullet for him if he selects to do it.
 
 
A 170gr Federal 30-30 :

Energy in Foot Pounds

Muzzle

100

200

300

400

500

1827

1354

990

719

535

424

A 180 Nosler Partition HE Federal 30-06:

Energy in Foot Pounds

Muzzle

100

200

300

400

500

3315

2881

2494

2148

1842

1570

A 338 win mag 225 gr Barnes Tripple Shock Federal:

Energy in Foot Pounds

Muzzle

100

200

300

400

500

3917

3289

2742

2270

1863

1519

A 375 H&H 300 gr Nosler Partition Federal:

Energy in Foot Pounds

Muzzle

100

200

300

400

500

4263

3572

2971

2451

2010

1641



Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - June/07/2008 at 17:54
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 17:18
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this is the place where i get into trouble in here, i know for a fact that my dad has killed more elk with his trusty old 336c marlin 30-30 than any of his other rifles have combined, all with a plane jane 150gr sierra bullet, now for a novice hunter i wouldnt recommend this, for him its completely acceptable, course now that i have loaned him my 300 win for the last 8yrs he takes the 300 for long shots but while doing his spot and stalk work in the trees the 30-30 is all he carries, as far as bears go, unless your in grizzly country a black bear is more likely to run away from you than attack, unless she has cubs with her, thats a whole nother ball game then, grizzly bears and lions roll of the dice which way they run. .338 and .375 imo are overkill for elk especially the .375 the .338 is god plenty for elk, the 30-06 and any other members of its family are quite capable of taking elk with ease also, shot placement in my book trumps big enough gun, remember the bigger the gun  the bigger the recoil. a good shot with a 30-30 is better than a bad shot with a .375, use a good quality bullet and the 25-06 and .257wby are good enough for elk.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 17:46
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25-06 115 gr Nosler Partition:

Energy in Foot Pounds

Muzzle

100

200

300

400

500

2344

1981

1665

1390

1152

946

I've heard of several people taking elk with at 25-06 and the guy I know who has shot the most elk always usea a 270, but I still think that a 30-06 is the right choice and since I dont have a 30-06 right now and I do have a .375 H&H barrel for my Encore I wouldnt be a bit shy about hunting an elk with it.  I know people use 30-30s for elk but it wouldnt be my first choice.


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - June/07/2008 at 17:51
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 17:51
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i agree wes, the 30-30 is not my first choice either, i used a 30-06 for a long time, the 7mm mag is a good choice as well
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 17:59
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For the elk's sake, I'd rather he move up a couple of notches to be both human and a bit more forgiving with the shot. The important question though is your nephew of a stature to use a larger gun? 
 
People farm raise elk around here for chinese medicine.  They are about the size of a good long legged cow.  I've shot enough sick cows with a 30-30 at close range to want a larger gun.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 18:03
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I really tend to think the 30-06 is the perfect choice as it has so many factory loads available and the ammo is relatively inexpensive and can be found anywhere. The 7mm mag is a fine rifle as is the 300 Win Mag but they are more recoil than most people care for. The 270 on the other hand has a lot going for it and is reasonable as far as recoil. I have always been more into 30cal guns but I think I would really like a 270 and I am intrigued by the high balistic coeffecient of the 6.5mm so a 6.5 mm might be a lot of fun. The trouble with lots of the interesting calibers is that ammo is either unavailable in remote places or very expensive if it can be found. It's not that way with 30-30 and 30-06 and .270 because these have been the traditional hunting cartridges in the U.S.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 18:20
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PREMIUM VITALSHOK

 

Federal Load No.

Factory Primer No.

Caliber

Bullet Weight
Grains / Grams

Bullet style

Use

T.B*

HE

P308G

210

308 Win. (7.62x51mm)

180 / 11.66

Nosler Partition

3

24

Velocity in Feet Per Second

Muzzle

100

200

300

400

500

2740

2551

2370

2196

2030

1870

Energy in Foot Pounds

Muzzle

100

200

300

400

500

3000

2601

2245

1928

1647

1398

Wind Drift in Inches 10 MPH Crosswind

100

200

300

400

500

0.7

2.8

6.8

12.5

20.2

Average Range

50

100

200

300

-0.1

-3.8

-13.9

Long Range

50

100

200

300

400

500

0.8

1.9

-8.2

-23.5

-47.1

This HE Federal 180 gr Nosler Partition for a .308 looks like a winner too.

Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - June/07/2008 at 18:22
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 18:47
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thanks for all the replies, I kinda figured that would be the general concensus, once I get the maps for the area were hunting we will get a better idea of the terrain we'll be in and try to figure out shot distances, hopefully with plenty of bench work with his gun he will do just fine.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 19:27
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i prefer the .280 over the .270 and 30-06, you load up a good quality 150gr 7mm bullet and its a nice subtle round to shoot and plenty of oomph  to knock elk down, the 7mm sd and bc is better than that of the 30-06. that .308 round isnt a half bad idea though.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 19:50
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Doesn't Hornady make some kind of souped up ammo for the 30-30? Might make the 30-30 a little better if it is the lads only option.
 
Roy
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 19:53
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leverevolution roy,
 
 
30-30 Win 160 gr FTX LEVERevolution
82730
Velocity (fps) / Energy (ft-lbs)
Muzzle 100 yd 200 yd 300 yd 400 yd 500 yd
2400/2046 2150/1643 1916/1304 1699/1025
Trajectory (inches)
Muzzle 100 yd 200 yd 300 yd 400 yd 500 yd
-1.7 3.0 0.2 -12.1
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/07/2008 at 23:04
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If this may be a rare or possibly a once in a life time hunt for him, it would be a shame to risk being under-gunned. If he can handle a 30-30 he should have no trouble with a 30 06 especially having ample time to build some confidence with it. Do every thing you can to help him not have regrets. Ruger is not my first choice for any rifle for me, but their design has handled recoil suprisingly well. I had a Rem 7mm BDL that I couldn't stand because even though it was built alittle on the heavy side it kicked the shhhnot out of me. I got rid of it and didn't like the 7mm cal. because of it. A few yrs. back I was helping a friend new to deer hunting zero his rifle, a 7mm. But it was the Ruger M77 and I couldn't believe how light the recoil was with 150's. If at some time I feel the need for a 7mm I'm gonna give the M77 another look. You might do him another favor and put a recoil boot on what ever he uses. My daughter loves to shoot and she doesn't shy away from the heavier cals. at all. But all the talking in the world sometimes isn't enough to prevent scope-eye. So I make sure there is a boot on anything she shoots that has chambered a heavy grain round. Over 130 gr. for her since she only weighs about 115 to 120. Let us know what you decide and good luck! Howdy
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 08:01
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How old / big is your nephew ? Experience level ?

A properly constructed ( I like Fed'l 170 gr partition 30/30 load...seen it work on bear --but at 35 yd.s ) will work, but range and shot placement will BE critical..
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 09:20
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Originally posted by Sgt. D Sgt. D wrote:

If this may be a rare or possibly a once in a life time hunt for him, it would be a shame to risk being under-gunned. If he can handle a 30-30 he should have no trouble with a 30 06 especially having ample time to build some confidence with it. Do every thing you can to help him not have regrets. Ruger is not my first choice for any rifle for me, but their design has handled recoil suprisingly well. I had a Rem 7mm BDL that I couldn't stand because even though it was built alittle on the heavy side it kicked the shhhnot out of me. I got rid of it and didn't like the 7mm cal. because of it. A few yrs. back I was helping a friend new to deer hunting zero his rifle, a 7mm. But it was the Ruger M77 and I couldn't believe how light the recoil was with 150's. If at some time I feel the need for a 7mm I'm gonna give the M77 another look. You might do him another favor and put a recoil boot on what ever he uses. My daughter loves to shoot and she doesn't shy away from the heavier cals. at all. But all the talking in the world sometimes isn't enough to prevent scope-eye. So I make sure there is a boot on anything she shoots that has chambered a heavy grain round. Over 130 gr. for her since she only weighs about 115 to 120. Let us know what you decide and good luck! Howdy
i really like the 7mm mag for a elk rifle, loaded up with a good quality 150 or 165gr bullet, or even get something lighter and use a barnes tsx in a 120 or a 140gr bullet and still get pretty good performance.
im surprised that the m700 you had kicked that bad, usually its the rugers that kick like a mule.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 10:06
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Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

i really like the 7mm mag for a elk rifle, loaded up with a good quality 150 or 165gr bullet, or even get something lighter and use a barnes tsx in a 120 or a 140gr bullet and still get pretty good performance.
im surprised that the m700 you had kicked that bad, usually its the rugers that kick like a mule.
 
 
Agreed, I still don't understand what made the difference. But it wasn't just me, I was so impressed I had a couple of other experienced hunters shoot the 77 and they were surprised as well. If anyone has experience with it maybe you can shed some light on this Phenom.
 
Thinking back, I really don't understand why that BDL punched so bad. I have zeroed 300's that don't even come close to what it was doing. Maybe it wasn't as heavy as I'm remembering. Reguardless, I wouldn't consider handing that one to a young hunter.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 10:19
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my old man has a m70 in a 30-06 that was just brutal, it was light and tight chambered and kicked like dirty bastard, i hated that rifle
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 12:22
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great information guys, thanks. I should say right off that my nephew is in his mid 20s(wish I was) 6' 180 or so, so I'm not worried about his shoulder, just want to make sure that with a good shot comes a good clean kill, we'll be in unit 86; ordering maps next week. This is our first elk hunt and as excited as I am now, its going to be a long 16 months.Yippee
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 17:13
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I figured he was a youngster...Forget the 30/30 ...go 30-06 or similar as a baseline ,,, Use heavy for caliber rounds that are well constructed ... partitions, scirocco,XP3,and the like..
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 17:33
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Originally posted by martin3175 martin3175 wrote:

I figured he was a youngster...Forget the 30/30 ...go 30-06 or similar as a baseline ,,, Use heavy for caliber rounds that are well constructed ... partitions, scirocco,XP3,and the like..
 
 
 
Ditto Dude
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get a 7mag and be done with it
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/08/2008 at 18:41
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Originally posted by 9-point 9-point wrote:

was wondering if a marlin 30-30 would be enough for elk and at what distance, my nephew will be going with me on a elk hunt in 09 and he recently bought that rifleI know its a good deer gun but not sure about anything bigger.
.................................A 30-30 would not be in my top picks for elk!! The biggest problem would be with the shooting range limitations with this cartridge @ 100-125 yards or less! Why do that??.............
 
 
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