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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/26/2008 at 10:42
lucytuma View Drop Down
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Any one here own or have experience with a double rifle IE: Nitro Express.  I know the double has very little use in North America and limited use in Africa, but they are very interesting to me.  Though my available funds forbid me from having one, I'd love to own a 450/400, some day I'm going to Africa and I'm going to hunt  a "M'bogo/Inyati" better known as buffalo.  I know a .375 bolt gun is pretty much standard for buffalo, but I'd sure like the chance of taken one with a double.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/26/2008 at 20:53
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Cape buffalo is also known as "black death". I lived in Liberia W Africa for about 6 months although they have "bush cow" there the opportunity to hunt in the bush never came around. Right after the civil war and UN peace keepers all over. Keep trying to get back there, however the only way I can get there is to find employment again. Kind of hard to do these days. I keep trying though gettin older every year....damn.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2008 at 09:08
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Just for grins you could reline an old double shotgun and make yourself one with the help of a gunsmith buddy.  Something you could fool around with and take a deer with....Bandito

Edited by Ed Connelly - October/29/2008 at 09:09
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2008 at 09:20
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You are a man after my own heart lucytuma, unfortunately my only experience is drooling over the pictures on the Holland & Holand website!

 
 


Edited by Dogger - October/29/2008 at 09:20
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2008 at 09:39
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Aren't those rifles amazing!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2008 at 14:57
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Originally posted by lucytuma lucytuma wrote:

Any one here own or have experience with a double rifle IE: Nitro Express.  I know the double has very little use in North America and limited use in Africa, but they are very interesting to me.  Though my available funds forbid me from having one, I'd love to own a 450/400, some day I'm going to Africa and I'm going to hunt  a "M'bogo/Inyati" better known as buffalo.  I know a .375 bolt gun is pretty much standard for buffalo, but I'd sure like the chance of taken one with a double.
...................Yesterday on a hunting channel, I saw Boddington use a double for elephant hunting. The show didn`t specify the caliber. Probably one of the Nitros. I have fired them at the range, but have not hunted with one.
 
For the fastest follow up shot, a double is great. In that regard, for close range elephant hunting, a double would have the advantage assuming a quick two shots are all you need. But then, you have to reload.
 
Imo, other than close elephant work, there are no the other advantages for a double. Better for the elephants. 
 
With 3 rounds in the magazine and 1 in the chamber using a bolt, I wonder which would be faster in getting off 4 rounds, the double or the bolt?? I like my chances with a bolt without any reloading. 
 
Also, those doubles aren`t exactly light in weight to lug around in 100-110+ degree African heat.
 
I`ll take the bolt with a low variable for all around African and caped buff use. Beyond 50-60 yards, assuming a closer shot isn`t available, a scope is a better idea anyway.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2008 at 15:57
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The idea of the double rifle is not only a quick second shot, although that is the most obvious. I have watched shows where they are practicing reloading( the 2 rounds in the fingers ), they are fast. Cycling a bolt action; you must bring rifle down from target to cycle the bolt( I know you may not have to with your 270 ) then bring it back to target, re-aim and fire again. The reason for the double ( if you ask a dedicated user) is follow-up shot, redundancy (what do you do if you have a misfire or partial fire or a broken firing pin) with another chamber that will still work, and then quick to re-load.

If I have the option of acquainting myself with and using a double to hunt Elephant and Hippo and to a lesser degree "Black Death" I am sure I would feel better, (provided I could use it proficiently) using it.
Many African guides will only use a double in case their client fails to kill to keep themselves from being killed.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2008 at 16:01
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That right there makes some very good sense.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2008 at 19:17
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Originally posted by n101rg n101rg wrote:

The idea of the double rifle is not only a quick second shot, although that is the most obvious. I have watched shows where they are practicing reloading( the 2 rounds in the fingers ), they are fast. Cycling a bolt action; you must bring rifle down from target to cycle the bolt( I know you may not have to with your 270 ) then bring it back to target, re-aim and fire again. The reason for the double ( if you ask a dedicated user) is follow-up shot, redundancy (what do you do if you have a misfire or partial fire or a broken firing pin) with another chamber that will still work, and then quick to re-load.

If I have the option of acquainting myself with and using a double to hunt Elephant and Hippo and to a lesser degree "Black Death" I am sure I would feel better, (provided I could use it proficiently) using it.
Many African guides will only use a double in case their client fails to kill to keep themselves from being killed.
....................."Cycling a bolt action; you must bring the rifle down from the target, re-aim and fire again."...............Not necessarily! With some practice, one can re-cycle the bolt (during recoil recovery and barrel re-settling) while keeping the rifle`s butt securely against the shoulder, re-aim and fire very quickly. Either on the "gunsandammo" or "shootingtimes" magazine site, there is a video showing a Howa bolt in 300 Win being rapidly cycled without bringing the rifle down from the shoulder to do so.
 
With the heavier recoiling calibers it does take some extra practice using a bolt action.
 
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2008 at 19:24
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Correction!...............The video is on the "rifleshootermag" website!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2008 at 19:29
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1981  I worked in a gunstore in San Antonio while attending Police academy. The owner was quite the africa hunter and had a great fondness for double rilfes. I have had the opportunity to examine quite a few of them and have a couple of friends who have hunted Africa with them.  They are an absolute work of art but I simply can not justify the price on what I make.  I'd say buy an Encore - think of it as half of a double rifle.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2008 at 22:58
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Yes I agree that you can with practice cycle a rifle in recoil, you cannot recover as fast as a double rifle and hunting dangerous game in Africa if you have a malfunction(case separation, primer pocket blows up, firing pin, etc etc etc. I would prefer to have another chamber sitting there just begging to be reloaded or fired. Sorry your argument won't win with me, not with dangerous game like elephant, and hippo,especially. I want every chance I can of going home in the seat not a box.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 02:18
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Originally posted by n101rg n101rg wrote:

Yes I agree that you can with practice cycle a rifle in recoil, you cannot recover as fast as a double rifle and hunting dangerous game in Africa if you have a malfunction(case separation, primer pocket blows up, firing pin, etc etc etc. I would prefer to have another chamber sitting there just begging to be reloaded or fired. Sorry your argument won't win with me, not with dangerous game like elephant, and hippo,especially. I want every chance I can of going home in the seat not a box.
..............Well! You`re right! A double can get 2 rounds off faster assuming that is all the firepower that is needed! A definite advantage! But 4 rounds? I don`t think so!
 
You gotta reload after firing round #2.... After your 2nd round you have to bring a double down from the shoulder, open `er up, load up, then re-shoulder, aim and fire. That`s where a well practiced, stand up, fast bolt operator will more than catch up. I`ll get 4 rounds off with accuracy, before a double can..............Come home in a box? I wouldn`t bet on it! 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 10:55
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Since I've been reading Boddington for over twenty years I like what he has to say. http://www.gunsandammomag.com/cs/Satellite/IMO_GA/Story_C/Double+or+Magazine?packedargs=pagenum%3D1
Double guns are sweet. All of mine are shotguns, but they are the only gun I carry for upland. I wish I could afford a double rifle but they are way beyond me.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 10:59
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I don't think it is about the amount of firepower Squeeze it is about the ability to still use your weapon if it has a failure.  Sounds pretty thought out and smart to me.  Same reason people carry back up guns.  But with this it is already right in your hand.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 11:22
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The doubles as I have stated, do have some advantages; up to and including 2 quick shots. In most cases, that is enough!
 
I don`t plan to, nor do I have the desire to ever hunt hippos or elephants. Caped buffs? Yep!
 
I guess I`ll just have to put up with my bolt!........Dammit!............Roll%20on%20Floor%20Laughing
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 12:54
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I stick by my original premise. Quality double rifles eject the spent cartridges of fired chambers making them very fast to drop two fresh cartridges in. The trick is hitting the target properly with the FIRST SHOT and having the rest as a backup. If all you plan on is hunting in Africa is "Bush Cow" and want to use a low power scope and shoot at 100 to 200 yards you bet 375H&H or similar cartridge works great. However if that Cape Buffalo runs off into the bush trailing blood waiting for me to trail him up I want that guide to have a double backing me up when I get in the thick brush which is where he will be waiting either dead or very much alive and very pissed off.

Sure hope I don't run into an elephant or hippo down by the river either. If I go to Africa again and am lucky enough to get to hunt I will probably be stuck with a bolt action or a 95 Winchester or something like that cause I can't afford a double H&H rifle, but I can dream can't I.

Don't take this so seriously we are speculating and expressing opinions here that is all.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 13:22
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Originally posted by Big Squeeze Big Squeeze wrote:

I guess I`ll just have to put up with my bolt!........Dammit!............Roll%20on%20Floor%20Laughing


Like the majority of us that will pony up the dollars to go. I might consider a larger bore than my .375 H&H, though.
BTW, there was a .375 H&H flanged magnum specifically for doubles.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 15:25
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Originally posted by lucytuma lucytuma wrote:

Any one here own or have experience with a double rifle IE: Nitro Express.  I know the double has very little use in North America and limited use in Africa, but they are very interesting to me.  Though my available funds forbid me from having one, I'd love to own a 450/400, some day I'm going to Africa and I'm going to hunt  a "M'bogo/Inyati" better known as buffalo.  I know a .375 bolt gun is pretty much standard for buffalo, but I'd sure like the chance of taken one with a double.
 
I'm with you lucytuma!  I've fondled a couple and it was pure joy.  It was like pointing my finger.  BS can keep his bolt, me, I don't want to cycle a bolt if my life flashes before my eyes!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 17:12
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I think I've read that you should be able to  fire a double gun four times, quicker than you than you can fire a bolt gun four times.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2008 at 17:39
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Cabelas had some double rifles on their website and in the store , I did handle one in the store and the H&H are great rifles but we don't have a lot of use for them in Kansas. I would sure take one if they were giving them away. A 375 H&H is a little much for a coyote but I would do it once.
 
Duce Bucky
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Hey since you got 2 barrels you might as well do it twice
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/05/2008 at 06:51
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Sounds like fun Duce!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/05/2008 at 08:31
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This argument goes back a long way, which is better, the bolt action or double. It is the same argument as which caliber is best. It cannot be won, unless two guys are prepared to stand back to back and count 25 paces, one with a double (clutching two rounds in his fingers!!)and one with a bolt action (magazine loaded, empty shell in the breach) ....
 
 
Many professional hunters swear by the double, equally many by the bolt action.
 
For hunting the animal and getting the first shot in without the animal being aware of the hunters presence, I would prefer a magazine bolt action rifle. If I wounded the animal, I still have two or three shots available, and not one if it were a double.
For following up on a wounded animal I do not think it matters as there is rarely time for more then 2 shots anyway.
I also think that a professional who uses the rifle often can reload a double quite quickly. A once- in -a- while hunter, coming on safari may find a bolt action more familiar.
 
But tht is only me thinking. As I said, this argument helps to keep the campfire talk alive and the whisky go down smoothly, and that is all.


Edited by 8shots - November/05/2008 at 08:37
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/05/2008 at 08:47
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very good 8shots.......................me, too.....I would be perfectly happy to hunt bad stuff with a double...... 
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