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Does anybody (inc USMC) use MDot? 20# rif

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2005 at 17:09
ba_50 View Drop Down
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It looks like it would be a lot of trouble to stop and figure out distances using a MilDot. It was wrote up somewhere that the Marines sight in at 500 yards and either hold on the crotch under 500 yards and on or near the head at 1000 which simplifies things. Does anybody really go to the trouble of doing the figuring? I can definitly see an advantage shooting long range and having a mark for holdover and am looking into getting a scope wtih one.

 

I don't understand why the Marines went to a 20# bench rest (sniper) rifle vs the varmint weight version. It seems to me they are defeating the purpose  of being a sniper. I would want something I could move fast with if necessary. Does anyone know what their thinking is on this? Why don't they carry range finders instead of an extra heavy rifle?

 

Is the Army's sniper rifle 20# too?

 

Just curious.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2005 at 22:49
Mithran View Drop Down
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Wasn't a sniper but after spending about 3 years with a line platoon I moved to the armory and was in charge of the snipers gear.  Marine Scout Snipers are mildot range estimation pro's.  They do use range finders if available.  The ones I worked with were always out around the barracks doing range estimation and observation training.  I don't know if your hold off thing about aiming at the crotch closer than 500 yards is what they did, but I can tell you that all Marines sniper or grunt are always trained to aim for center mass.  Snipers shoot for the brain box more than grunts do, but they have the weapons to do it.  As far as a heavy precision weapon vs. a lighter varmint rifle, weight makes better accuracy.  Their M40A3's weigh in at about 17 pounds and are some of the most accurate rifles in the world.  Stealth is what sniper rely on rather than speed.  If compromised sniper have other weapons in the team to break contact with and a radio which is one of the most deadly weapons in the world.

 

Not sure if the Army's M24 is a 20# rifle but they are both built on the Rem700 action, the Marines use a short action and the Army uses a long action in case of the need to convert to .300 winmag, which they rarely do anyway.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/03/2005 at 20:52
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The M24 and M40A3 are faternal twins (sight differences) but very similar in appearance. The barrle on every M24 I ever used had no taper. Regular line Infantry units normally do not run 300WM due to ammunition supply issues.

For range estimation. Like Mithran said we did it all the time. It becomes second nature (gotta love that repetative training). I could be + / - 25 to 50 yds with out doing the "math" with my eye and the spotter always verified range to target with the laser.

As far as moving fast with one if you need to. When you get used to carrying a heavy rifle it no longer seems heavy. When I was younger I carried the M60. When I got back from school I was issued a M21it was so light it felt like a toy compared to my pig.

For anyone working in small numbers out away from friendly forces stealth = longer life. Plus you always have the most powerful weapon system in the world, "the radio". One well trained spotter with a radio can unleash horrific damage in mere seconds.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/04/2005 at 08:56
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Let's say you are out past the front lines and make your shot. Is the procedure to stay hid and rely on camo till the heat is off, then sneak back out, or do they leave the area right away? If you leave the area any movement can be spotted, based on my hunting experience. Of course the different circumstances come into play, but using artillery close in doesn't seem like a good idea.  

 

When I was elk hunting in the mountains, even a standard weight rifle and scope got heavy.



Edited by ba_50
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/04/2005 at 10:56
Mithran View Drop Down
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Good snipers when they take a shot shouldn't be compromised by taking a shot.  What if two teams take their shots from two different directions on the same group of enemy infantry.  There is no way you can triangulate where the shots came from if two guys drop but you only hear one boom.  Snipers are more scouts than shooters, more there for support.  If artillery has to be called in they are a good distance away.  They could have more than just arty at their disposal.  They could have fixed wing or rotory wing, mortars heavy and light which can be called closer than arty.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/10/2005 at 20:18
ba_50 View Drop Down
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Mithran,

 

Thanks for the information. I just got through driving 1300 miles so had a small interval there. I have one more question, and that is how much of a factor is  body heat sensing  equipment? Thank you. Bob

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2005 at 00:05
Mithran View Drop Down
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They are expensive.  I've used them before.  A sniper with a ghille suit on might be hard to spot from a long distance if they stayed real still.  Someone would be easy to spot if they were on the side of a hill with a dark backdrop, but if they were on the same level ground as you in the prone with lots of vegitation you could evade someone with a thermal scope.  They work well.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/25/2005 at 14:31
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I have wondered about evading a thermal scope. One posibility might be to use something like the thermal survival blankets that reflect a majority of your body heat back toward you. The only other option I see is to  get him before he gets you. The last unit I was attache to had thermal but someone broke it before I got to play with it.
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