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Do semi-auto’s cause scope problems?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/05/2006 at 07:55
jimmy-buffett View Drop Down
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Can the back/forward action of a semi-automatic centerfire cause problems with some low-end scopes?

 

I grew up with a Marlin .22 bolt-action that I used for squirrel hunting, and this thing was just about as reliable and accurate as you can get.  I put a cheap little Bushnell 3-9 power on it and it just shoots like a dream.  About one time in four I can hit the pushpins holding the target up on the 50 yard range.

 

Move that Bushnell to my Ruger Mini-14 Ranch, and the shots are all over the place (by that I mean most/all within a 4-5 inch circle at 50 yards, uninspiring).  Now Mini's aren't known for their accuracy, and to be honest the scope mounts they provide on the Ranch are pretty much junk.  I switched to the peep sight and actually had better accuracy with that (16 out of 20 in a 3x3 inch square, the rest very close).

 

So I'm wondering if it's possible that the back/forward motion of the semi-automatic that could be giving my cheap little Bushnell some problems.  I tried Google and couldn't find anything about this topic, so maybe it's just me.

 

The reason that I ask is that I recently upgraded to a JLD PTR-91 (H&K 91 clone in .308), and I'm driving about 75 miles in a couple of weeks to sight it in (the closest range I could find that goes out to 200+ yards).  I want to do it right the first time, so if I get there and the Bushnell is again all over the place, it will feel like a wasted trip.

 

So am I fine with the Bushnell on this rifle out to 150-200 yards, or should I be upgrading?  With a budget of $200 or less and knowing that the rifle is a semi-automatic, is there a much better alternative?  I'm more interested in long range shooting for this rifle and not CQB/Home use, so I'm looking for a centerfire/deer scope rather than something that straddles the line between "tactical use" and decent accuracy at a hundred yards.

 

Thanks for reading!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/05/2006 at 10:47
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
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I have owned one of the ruger Mini 14 .223 rifles and at that time had 6 Colt AR-15 in different configurations and  I was quite disappointed with the lack of accuracy with the ruger semi auto .223.  I have had several Ruger 10-22 that all have been quite accurate and several of their bolt guns that are extremely accurate once you have them glass bedded. With .223 rifles you have to match the bullet weight with the twist of the barrel or the bullet does not stabalize in flight.  There are a few highly accurate semi auto centerfire rifles like GA Precision's custom built AR-10.

Most semi auto centerfire rifles are built as battle rifles and shoot about 2 moa at best and often more like 4moa. Now most centerfire bolt action rifles shoot under 1moa on a bad day and the really top of the line from TAC-OPS and GA Precision shoot 1/4 moa out to about 1000 yds + reliably.  The Savage rifles with accutrigger are quite reasonably priced and shoot well.  As for the optics you get what you pay for, sometimes less, never more. You have several options: One is accuracy gunsmith work on the mini 14 http://www.clarkcustomguns.com/m14parts.htm  This is probably money well spent if you like the rifle. If you want to be truly accurate you are talking bolt action rifle.  As for an H&K clone the scope mount for the H&K 91 that I bought in 1977 was several hundred dollars for the mount alone. I no longer have this but the conclusion is that it's likely to be expensive to scope that rifle.

As for the scope work your way up to a Nikon Monarch 6x42  at $249. you will have a bright optic with good glass and nice reliable adjustments - you will be able to tell the difference. If you stay away from the bottom of the line with any of the manufacturer you will find that the quality goes up significantly and the performance is noticable. I dont think you need to drop a grand into a S&B etc to get a good scope but if you aren't paying over 200 you arent buying much in the way of reliability and its tough to find a good scope for less than 250 once you get to 300 + there are lots of choices and over 500 they better be pretty darn good or they wont be around long. Nikon's Monarch line seem to be a good price to value.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/05/2006 at 11:19
jimmy-buffett View Drop Down
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I sold the Mini-14 to pay for the HK clone, so it's not really an issue anymore.  I liked it for what it was: cheap, reliable, maybe not something to have a contest with but I knew that going in.  You can't expect too much out of a (edit: semi-auto) rifle that costs less than what I'd spend on a decent pistol.

 

If you buy the genuine HK (tm) scope mount, yeah that will run you a few hundred bucks.  You'll also pay several hundred dollars for the genuine HK (tm) stock with the adjustable cheek rest for the PSG1/Sniper variants of the rifle.  Point being, yeah if you go genuine HK all the way you're gonna pay a ton.  I found a non-HK brand mount that fits the standard mounting points on the rifle, I think I paid $75 for it.

 

Wal-Mart has a Leupold 2-7x33 online for $179, I don't know anything about it except the name though.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/06/2006 at 00:00
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I have mounted several scopes on semi-automatic rifles with no trouble, including the Mini-14 and Remington's 742 in .30-06.  No problems with the (old) Redfield widefield, the current Weaver Grand Slam or Leupolds.

 

You may have to shop through different brands and types of ammo to find out what your particular mini-14 likes.   My  ;Ranch Rifle liked Federal American Eagle in FMJ  better than Winchester's "white box" FMJ ammo.

 

A 4 to 5 inch circle at 50 yards is completely unacceptable.  So is a "3x3 inch" square.  You should be looking at less than 2 inches with almost any acceptable ammo.  Something was seriously wrong here.  There's nothing wrong with Ruger's Ranch Rifle scope mounts in my experience.  The Mini-14 doesn't have enough recoil to bother either the scope or the shooter in any normal circumstances.  

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/06/2006 at 20:10
Tip69 View Drop Down
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I have 3 Browning BARs in 30-06......308......243........... no problems with these messing with my scopes.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/08/2006 at 15:20
jimmy-buffett View Drop Down
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A 4 to 5 inch circle at 50 yards is completely unacceptable. 

 

Agreed, that's why I pulled the scope off.  I haven't tried another scope on it yet, but as I sold the Mini-14 to pay for the HK, it's no longer my concern.

 

So is a "3x3 inch" square.

 

As the original post says, this is what I was shooting when I took the scope off and switched to the factory peep sight.  Now I'm no expert, but being that's with no magnification and the big clumsy front pin on the Mini-14, I was impressed with the consistency of it.

 

(Edit) Here's a couple of pictures as examples:

 

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/2889/me1ty9.jpg

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/3701/me2td1.jpg

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