New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Decisions Decisions. Another Scope question...
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Check GunBroker.com for SWFA's No Reserve and No Minimum bid firearm auctions.

Decisions Decisions. Another Scope question...

 Post Reply Post Reply   Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 09:25
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Well I've been on various review, Forum sites trying to find some info on various Scopes. Needless to say unless your buying a 2k Optic you can find good and bad reviews on about everything.

There are no real stores where I am where I can see them back to back so I am hoping someone can recommend a few good scopes 'for the money' I am not new to long range shooing and I know for what I need the scope for less than $600 should do the trick. ( About 7 years ago I owned a Millet LRS and shot my 308 really consistently to 1000yds. I dont really want to get another one because either I was fortunate to get a good one or there quality went to hell...

Anyway, I am looking for a Tactical Longer range scope, to make it easy I'll give you all the details...

It is going on a Savage Model 10TR in .308 This will be a Target/Competition/Occasional hunting gun
Shots will be taken anywhere from 100 to an absolute max of 1000 yards, and it will be very rare I do that. Mostly this gun will be used for work in the 400-800 yd range.

mil-dot, Mil turrets (preferably)

I would like 24x or more to see more target ( I know you can hit man sized targets on just 10x I have done it before so I dont need that lecture. I just like to see more, I've got a 16x on a .16HMR and sometimes I want more lol...

A first Focal plane scope would be ideal but you jump up alot in price for those.

I dont think its benificial to have a fixed magnification scope for what I am using it for. or not?


Any opinions are appreciated. Thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 09:30
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
I know the quality control on some of the chineese scopes are bad, but lets face it unless your buying 1K plus scope most are made there. and believe it or not a POS walmart centerpoint 16x is on my Savage /17 HMR and I cant believe how that scope operates for $70.... It was within 2-3 % deviation in the box test, clarity is great etc. I just wouldnt be seen with it on my .308 Cool

I have been looking at Sight Mark
Falcon
Bushnell
Nikon
Counter Sniper
etc....

so many damn manufactures out its insane.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 10:35
Sparky View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire


Joined: July/15/2007
Status: Offline
Points: 3190
First I would only be looking at either the Nikon or the Bushnell off your list. For the Counter Sniper just does a search here and see what comes up. Or I will save you the time and just say there are much better choices for the money.

For a 308 to go from 100 to 1000yds requires quite a bit of elevation adjustment. Most scopes just do not have it. And you may know this or not, but when you look at the specs for elevation adjustment that is total. So if you are using a 0 MOA base you will have roughly half of that. You could use a MOA base such as a 20 or a 40 MOA base but that may make it so you can not zero at 100yds.

It is not the magnification, but the glass quality that makes a difference. Had this same discussion earlier this year at the range. The short is Fact we all could see the target and details better with my Nightforce 3.5-15x50 set at 10x than we could with his Leupold VXIII 6.5-20x40 at 20x. Or the same thing comparing my Nikon 13-30x50ED spotting scope to his Nikon Prostaff 20-60x60 spotting scope. Both of his had 2x the magnification, but we could still see better with better glass.

For you budget and uses I would be looking at the SS 3-15x42. It can be had until the end of the day on 12/2 for $559.96 by using the promo code of 20SS315.

http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-15x42-Tactical-Rifle-Scope-P62238.aspx
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 10:45
Sparky View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire


Joined: July/15/2007
Status: Offline
Points: 3190
Also just for a reference looking at a target at 1000yds with 15x is similar to looking at a target at 67yds without any magnification.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 11:31
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Hey thanks for the replys guys. I know at 1000 yds 15x is plenty especially since groups open up a little more due to the many factors in shooting. The most reason I want more mag is for the shorter distances to put a 3 shot group under 3 inches at 3 to 400 yds.

I was looking at those scopes and they do look nice. Is there any other in a higher mag? I do prefer the bigger objective 50mm plus and big 30.m tubes plus.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 11:33
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
I will have a 20 moa base and like I said if I'm ever shooting 1000 yds I'll have to either dope it or something else but where I'm shooting 4-800 will be more like it.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 17:07
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Any others?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 23:35
jawbone View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: July/17/2013
Location: Washington
Status: Offline
Points: 15
If you can come down to 15x magnification, check out the the SWFA SS 3-15x42.  It comes in around $700.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 00:21
koshkin View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Dark Lord of Optics

Joined: June/15/2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 10969
Unless I missed it, you did not indicate what price range you are comfortable with.

Without that, it is hard to make recommendations.

Assuming you are in the sub-$1k price range, there are not that many good FFP options. Realistically, there are only these:

SWFA SS 3-15x42 for around $700
Weaver Tactical 3-15x50 for around $750
Vortex PST 4-16x50 for around $900
Vortex PST 6-24x50 for around $950
Sightron S3 6-24x50 for around $1k (they introduced a FFP Version of this scope earlier this year)
Bushnell Elite Tactical 6-24x50

If you prefer to save some money and go with a second focal plane scope, there are a few that fit your requirements:

Bushnell Elite, Vortex PST and Sightron S3 are available with SFP reticle for a couple of hunderd dollars less
Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50 for under $500 is worth a look.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 09:30
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Yea, I wanted to be under $600. it's on my first post in all my ramble... lol

Thanks for all the input, Choosing a scope is harder than picking a name for my second kid.... no really it is.

Anyway I think I have narrowed it down to a feew different kinds, Falcon,Vortex, and Bushnell

One last question, The Falcon for example has the same scope in 50mm and 56mm. Will it be that beneficial to get the 56?.. I do not believe the 56mm comes with an illuminated reticle, in which I have been known to do some 'night time' hunting. What do you guys think. given same price/ scope everything... 50 or 56mm?  The gun will be used for all types of shooting from the bench to from a tree. Thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 11:50
koshkin View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Dark Lord of Optics

Joined: June/15/2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 10969
Originally posted by LureM In LureM In wrote:

Yea, I wanted to be under $600. it's on my first post in all my ramble... lol

Thanks for all the input, Choosing a scope is harder than picking a name for my second kid.... no really it is.

Anyway I think I have narrowed it down to a feew different kinds, Falcon,Vortex, and Bushnell

One last question, The Falcon for example has the same scope in 50mm and 56mm. Will it be that beneficial to get the 56?.. I do not believe the 56mm comes with an illuminated reticle, in which I have been known to do some 'night time' hunting. What do you guys think. given same price/ scope everything... 50 or 56mm?  The gun will be used for all types of shooting from the bench to from a tree. Thanks

I am not convinced any Falcon would be beneficial to you.  I have yet to see a Falcon scope worth buying, but perhaps they have improved since I have last looked at them.

Since you want to reach a bit further out and you will need to dial a lot skimping on a scope is a bit dicey, but it is your money.

Generally, for people who want a high magnification variable my two default recommendations have been Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50 for the $500 and under crowd and Sightron S3 6-24x50 (the newer version with the exposed turrets) for the $1000 and under crowd.

I havn't gotten any complaints on those two options yet.

If you are dead set on staying under $600, you should probably give up on FFP and stick to SFP scopes.  From there, you need to make sure the scope has good turrets and enough elevation adjustment to suit your needs.  

Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50 has 65MOA of adjustment, so with a 20MOA base, you should have plenty left.

Vortex HS-T 4-16x44 has 75 MOA and a better turret for frequent adjustment than the regular Viper (I am testing one of these now and it is a nice little scope)

Sightron S3 6-24x50 has 100MOA of adjustment (a bit over 80MOA for the FFP version).

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 12:06
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
I do appriciate the input very much, I am thinking any scope in my price range is going to be hit or miss, Ive seen love them and hate them comments on every damn brand it seems.

I actually am getting two scopes, one for my new .308 and one for my 17hmr that is extremely accurate. (Ive done alot of accurizing to it, thing will shoot .5Moa at 200yards w/ little wind all day)

I want to get the same manufacture for both scopes, so right now im to the 

Falcon 5-25 for the .308
and 4-16 for the .17

or the 

Vortex 6.5-20 for the .308
and 4-16 for the .17

Koshkin thanks for all the help, It's taken about 3 days to narrow it down to those scopes lol... Should just use the Credit card on a night force and be done with it, haha.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 12:09
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
p.s. The only reason im leaning to the Falcon is the FFP. I actually have only used one scope with that feature ever and I think I like it alot more than the SFP. Just for the mere fact I like to do alot of range estimation with it and vary my power alot when playing Wack-A-Mole with ground hogs from 50-3-400yds.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 12:27
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
One last question would I need SWFA medium rings for the savage model 10, for 50mm objective?

And anyone know if the standard height will work with a 44mm on a savage model 93 both bull barrels.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 15:03
Rainman View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2012
Location: Washington Stat
Status: Offline
Points: 281
For comparison the optics setup on my Savage 10 .308 Precision Carbine is a 20 MOA Weaver picatinny rail with Burris Extreme 30mm medium rings, a Weaver 3-15x Tactical scope with 50mm objective lens and Butler Creek lens covers.  There is still about 1/8" clearance between the lens covers and barrel.  Low Burris Extreme rings might have worked and would definitely clear a 40 or 44 mm objective scope with similar length tube, ocular lens and eye relief.  SWFA had recommended the high Extreme rings but I was willing to deal with an exchange if necessary to keep the scope as low as possible.  The Savage Precision Carbine has a 20" heavy contour barrel.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 16:12
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Thanks for that, I have read on a bunch of forums that some people are using the LOW rings on 50mm lens and it clears by around an 1/8. I wonder if something is different on those because if I subtract the difference between the low and medium rings with your measurement it seems like the Low will not work since its .25" difference.  It seems If I go with the Low even if it would fit there definitely would be no room for optics covers?

The Model 10TR has the same barrel threaded. I want the Scope as low as possible for sure. So now im wondering weather to get the LOW or med's
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 17:06
Rainman View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2012
Location: Washington Stat
Status: Offline
Points: 281
I think my 50mm objective would clear with low rings, however possibly not with Butler Creek flip cap lens cover but it is a close call without actually trying it.  I use a strap on ammo carrier with zippered pocket on the butt which adds thin padding to the comb so my set up lines up quickly to my eye with the medium rings.  If you don't mind tinkering a bit it pays off in the end to get everything set up optimally for your primary shooting position. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 17:14
Sgt. D View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar

Joined: February/20/2008
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 3641
I am with you on wanting greater magnification. Yes you can do the job with less but why?? If you haven't checked out the Sample list be sure to do so. SWFA offers amazing deals on the full range of scopes. You can get into a super nice high end scope for a good deal. They have proven that they back every thing they sell. If you haven't seen the Sample list there is a link in the top right corner of all post pages. Look for the circled SL with buy-sell-trade under it. Good luck.
And Welcome to the OT!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 17:15
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
I dont know if I will have an ammo carrier I will either have that or an adjustible cheek piece, so I may want to just get the mediums. Id rather mess with the cheek part than have to send back rings, wait for them to get there and wait for new ones and be without a rifle for probably a week or two.

Damn I wish I knew if the lows would work. Anyone have Low's on there Savage?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 17:20
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Resident Redneck

Joined: June/20/2005
Location: Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 13877
If your quick you can pick up a fixed 16x which will do most of what you want so long as you have time to place the shot.  http://swfa.com/blackfriday/   <=====<<<< sale
SWFA SS 16x42 Tactical Riflescope SWFA SS 16x42 Tactical Riflescope
Stock # - SS16X42MQ
$299.95 $259.95Save: $40.00Ends: 12/2/2013  ="">
SWFA SS 3-15x42 Tactical Rifle Scope SWFA SS 3-15x42 Tactical Rifle Scope
Stock # - SS315X42MQ
  • Matte Finish
  • First Focal Plane
  • Patented Mil-Quad Reticle
  • 30mm Tube
  • Side Focus (6m-infinity)
  • OK for .50cal
  • .10 Mrad Turrets
  • IN STOCK
$699.95


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - December/01/2013 at 17:25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 17:27
Sgt. D View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar

Joined: February/20/2008
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 3641
Originally posted by LureM In LureM In wrote:

I dont know if I will have an ammo carrier I will either have that or an adjustible cheek piece, so I may want to just get the mediums. Id rather mess with the cheek part than have to send back rings, wait for them to get there and wait for new ones and be without a rifle for probably a week or two.

Damn I wish I knew if the lows would work. Anyone have Low's on there Savage?
 
Probably not. I can't put hands on one right now or I could tell you. It comes down to barrel contour and objective type. Even with a light barrel contour if the scope is a 50mm or larger and has an adjustable objective then I'm pretty sure it won't go. I have seen some rifles set with low rings on a 50mm with the scope set forward just a touch but, you could barely slide a piece of paper under it. One of those things you have to try sometimes to find out. Med rings really don't effect line of sight enough to cause noticeable negatives. Unless the shooter is of very small stature it doesn't effect cheek weld very much.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 18:04
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
yes the barrel on my rifle is heavy . It is just over an Inch diamater at the Nut, and slims to .75" at the Crown. Hoepfully someone will chime in whom perhaps owns a savage and has used the low rings?

Probably safe just to go with med rings, Id rather have a 1/8" gap then have a paper thin gap anyway. Thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2013 at 18:06
LureM In View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: November/30/2013
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
[QUOTE=Urimaginaryfrnd]
If your quick you can pick up a fixed 16x which will do most of what you want so long as you have time to place the shot.  http://swfa.com/blackfriday/   <=====<<<< sale


Hey thanks, I knew about those, I was contemplating the 16x very much, But I just like to have a variable zoon option if needed, It is a pain to gather a sight picture less than 100yds away with a constant 16x.


 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Similar Threads: "Decisions Decisions. Another Scope question..."
Subject Author Forum Replies Last Post
Decision for new scope SC Hunter Rifle Scopes 10 9/5/2006 9:11:42 PM
scope decisions 308 encore Rifle Scopes 2 12/4/2006 12:16:25 PM
Scope Decision army_eod Tactical Scopes 2 7/4/2007 5:18:32 AM
$500 Tactical Scope Decision bato762 Tactical Scopes 16 10/16/2007 6:59:05 AM
Kahles or Conquest decision Lobber Rifle Scopes 18 5/31/2007 9:47:56 PM
Final Decision shoot4fun Rifle Scopes 3 2/18/2007 2:25:30 AM
I think I’m Close to a Decision macky Tactical Scopes 3 2/26/2006 10:42:08 AM
Major decision time - XOTIC or SS Variabl greywolf Rifle Scopes 6 5/31/2005 12:02:35 PM
questions & scope decisions under $300 newscope Rifle Scopes 3 1/11/2006 3:41:01 AM
CZ 527 SCOPE/ NO SCOPE? JAMINGRIZZ Rifle Scopes 16


This page was generated in 0.844 seconds.