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Buying a new spotter

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 03:23
wyobowhunter1 View Drop Down
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I see you there are a few that are raving about the bushnell 20-60x80ED spotter.  My buddy has one and I hated the small eyepiece (the hole you look into the spotter seemed small compared to the higher end glass),  have they changed that and where is the best place to get one of these spotters?  I was looking at spending a lot more but if i can get the quality you say for this price I may reconsider my choice.  Was looking at the Vortex Razor HD- how do they compare?  Im brand new to the forum and so far IMPRESSED with the availability of info!!! Thanks!!!Excellent
 
 
Also which tripod should I get with either of these scopes that will be good all around and still lightweight enough to pack?  THANKS GUYS!!!Excellent
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 06:19
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Best place to buy one is right here.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 06:22
wyobowhunter1 View Drop Down
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Meaning?  Dont forget Im new to the forum!Bow
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 06:58
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Originally posted by wyobowhunter1 wyobowhunter1 wrote:

Meaning?  Dont forget Im new to the forum!Bow
Our sponcer sells optics and has 110% pricing policy.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 12:03
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 16:26
wyobowhunter1 View Drop Down
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What about your reviews? guess Im wanting someone to try to sell me on the Bushnell so i dont spend as much $$.  Has anyone looked through the Vortex Razor HD-  I just dont know if I like the eye relief on the Bushnell- seems pretty poor. If I remember Right the Razors eye relief was a lot better but I only had one chance to look through it.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 19:49
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I would never even dream of selling any spotter to anyone else.  Each individual's experience, education, expectations, and even eyesight are so uniquely their own that to do so would be just asking for disappointment.

I personally really like the Bushnell Elite 80mm.  My reviews of this scope should not be difficult to find. The basic gist can be found here: 

http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=15347

The Elite's eye relief as been adequate for me and I wear thick eyeglasses which make eye relief a real concern.  I've never seen the new Razor so; I can't comment on its virtues/liabilities.

Where do you live in Wyoming?  If you are anywhere near Kemmerer, you would be welcome to come and look through my Elite to see if it is what you are looking for. 


Edited by lucznik - March/29/2009 at 19:51
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 20:44
wyobowhunter1 View Drop Down
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Thanks lucznik-  I am only 45 miles from you-  I may take you up on that offer!!!  A buddy of mine also recommended the Skyline HD-  any thoughts on that? 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 22:08
lucznik View Drop Down
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The Bushnell Elite and the Skyline HD are optically very similar. 

The Skyline has a cool digiscoping adapter for use with point-and-shoot cameras that the Elite does not have.  The Elite, on the other hand, has a camera adapter for DSLR cameras that the Skyline does not have.  The Elite also has the possibility of being used with 22x and 30x fixed power, wide angle eyepieces - which the Skyline does not have. 

The Skyline is also significantly heavier than the Elite, which itself is not exactly light.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 23:51
wyobowhunter1 View Drop Down
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lucznik-  does your elite spotter have the big eyepiece like the skyline though-  thats the thing I did not like about my buddies elite spotter- thought the eye relief was not good at best and got worse as the power went up.  How does the new excursion 20-60x80 ED compare to the elite?  Seems like the size difference would be favorable.Say What 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 10:17
lucznik View Drop Down
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Even a fairly cursory examination of some of the various birding websites will reveal a generally held belief that bigger eyepieces = better eyepieces.  There is some truth this belief, though it's not as simple as just measuring the outside diameter of a group of eyepieces and proclaiming the widest one to be the best.  In fact,  the bigger = better equation is really, exactly backwards.  To be accurate, the logic should say that in general, better eyepieces have tended to be bigger (mostly because more glass is used), not the other way around.  Anyone can easily make their eyepieces bigger.  All they would have to do is elect for a thicker plastic and rubber to form the eyecup and focus-wheel cushioning. This would do nothing to improve the eyepiece's optical performance.
 
I've not made a direct comparison of the eyepieces from the Skyline and the Elite as I've never had the two scopes side by side.  Judging from my memory and from pictures I would guess that the Skyline's eyepiece is thicker.  The Elite has not changed or modified its basic zoom eyepiece since the scope's introduction so; the scope purchased today would undoubtedly have an eyepiece that is exactly the same as the one on your buddy's scope. Eye relief would also remain the same.  However, at its lowest magnification (20x) the Elite offers 18mm of ER.  If this is "not good," then you may need to be looking for a different style or class of scope alltogether as the Vortex does not offer much improvement (19mm @ 20x).   Aside from this and some cosmetic differences the two scopes appear to be otherwise virtually identical, leading me to suspect that they are manufactured by the same Japanese firm. I would also suspect that the quality of materials as well as the build quality will be virtually identical (though the Elite does have Bushnell's patented RainGaurd - if you believe in that stuff).
 
As I mentioned however, I would be careful not to assume that any difference in physical size automatically means that the Skyline's eyepiece has more glass involved or is somehow optically better.  The Vortex's eyepiece uses a more modern, twist-up plastic eyecup whereas the Bushnell uses an eyepiece with the older, fold-down rubber eyecup.  This alone could account for the increase in physical size.   It may be that the Vortex's eyepiece is indeed better, but it would require direct testing to show this and I am unaware of anyone who has done any such testing.   Also, unlike the Vortex Razor binocular, I have never read any review of the Skyline that suggested its eyepiece was any better than those from other scopes in its price category.  
 
Please don't take that as me dogging on the Vortex.  I just want to help you make your choices based on actual logic, rather than myth, faulty logic, or unsupported expectation. 
 
As to the Excursion; I have never handled the 80mm model, let alone compared one directly against these other scopes.  The build quality is an unknown as the scope is too new to have undergone any long-term or rigorous testing which is a factor that must be considered. Its folded-light-path (FLP) design is very similar (read practically identical) to the Leupold Golden Ring FLP scope that has enjoyed legendary status among outfitters, guides, and professional hunters for decades.  Because it is priced so much lower than the Leupold, there has to be the supposition that one of two things must be true.  Either:
  • somewhere, something was done to cut costs in the Bushnell FLP, thus creating the very real possibility that long term build quality and/or optical performance will suffer, or
  • we have to accept that Leupold's long-time, virtual monopoly over the FLP design has simply resulted in them overpricing the scope since there was really nothing similar against which to do a direct comparison. 

I suppose either of these possibilities has an equal chance of proving true though, my money would be on the former.  Zeiss also recently introduced a new FLP scope and it is priced at around $3000 USD.

This is not to say that I believe the Excursion to be a bad scope; just that it is a budget-class scope and therefore cannot be expected to perform as well or as long as might be expected of a similar, though higher priced scope.   In fact, I am still considering purchasing one of the 60mm Excursions.  At $320 and with its ultra-long eye relief and ED glass, it would seem a great scope for both knocking about and for letting kids and novices use.
 
As an aside, Bushnell apparently is wanting the military and law enforcement to take a serious look at the Excursion as they are now offering it in a special "tactical" version.  The de-badged 60mm Bushnell Elite has long been used by the military (as has the Leupold FLP) for sniper squads.
 
Originally posted by bushnell.com bushnell.com wrote:

...the 15-45x 60mm model is now available in a special Tactical version, with blackout exterior and a precision [first-focal plane] Mil-Dot reticle for ranging your target distance, at any magnification.
 
 


Edited by lucznik - March/30/2009 at 18:21
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 17:06
wyobowhunter1 View Drop Down
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Thanks! Lots of info to take in!!!  Is athere any where around here to look at some of these scopes?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 18:20
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There's a sporting goods store housed in the Jubilee grocery store in Evanston that stocks some Vortex stuff.  Their prices suck but, you might be able to at least look through the scope.  (I'm not entirely sure they have a Skyline.)

Sportsmans Warehouse in Salt Lake and/or the so-called "World's Largest Outfitter" in Lehi are your best "full-service" options - though again, the prices aren't usually very good.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/04/2009 at 17:45
wyobowhunter1 View Drop Down
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I checked out the Vortex skyline an jubilee-  Not the ed-  was nice but the brunton eterna ed was quite a bit nicer,  Dont know how the skyline ed would measure up?  Have you looked through the minox spotter?
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