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Burris Fullfield II 3-9x40 scope.....

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 14:23
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I have been searching for a scope to put on a H&R 45/70 Handi-Rifle. I am looking at the Burris Fullfield II in 3-9x40 because I can get it in a package deal with a free set of Burris binoculars. The only reservation that I have with the Fullfield II scopes is the eye relief that the factory list...3.1 to 3.8 inches. I know that the scope will have 3.8 inches at 3x power and 3.1 inches at 9x power. Is 3.1 inches at 9x power a little too short considering the recoil that a 45/70 can generate, especially in the Hand-Rifle? I looked at the Nikon Prostaff and Leupold Vari-X I for comparison and both companies list a eye relief of 3.6 inches. Does that mean that the Nikon and Leupold maintain the same eye relief throughout the entire magnification range or are they only listing the eye relief at the lowest power setiing..i.e. 3x power? Any comments back will be appreciated. I need to get a move on so that I can purchase the scope and get it mounted before deer season. Since I live in Mississippi, I will be using the Handi-Rifle during muzzleloader season this year.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 14:53
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Originally posted by bbush bbush wrote:

I have been searching for a scope to put on a H&R 45/70 Handi-Rifle. I am looking at the Burris Fullfield II in 3-9x40 because I can get it in a package deal with a free set of Burris binoculars. The only reservation that I have with the Fullfield II scopes is the eye relief that the factory list...3.1 to 3.8 inches. I know that the scope will have 3.8 inches at 3x power and 3.1 inches at 9x power. Is 3.1 inches at 9x power a little too short considering the recoil that a 45/70 can generate, especially in the Hand-Rifle? I looked at the Nikon Prostaff and Leupold Vari-X I for comparison and both companies list a eye relief of 3.6 inches. Does that mean that the Nikon and Leupold maintain the same eye relief throughout the entire magnification range or are they only listing the eye relief at the lowest power setiing..i.e. 3x power? Any comments back will be appreciated. I need to get a move on so that I can purchase the scope and get it mounted before deer season. Since I live in Mississippi, I will be using the Handi-Rifle during muzzleloader season this year.
........................Regardless of the free binocs or not, a 3x9 Fullfield or any 3x9,,, is NOT,,, the right scope for any 45-70 rifle; handi-rifle or otherwise!!!
 
Your shooting or hunting with a short to moderate range timber/brush rifle, not a longer range plains rifle.
 
A scope with fast aiming speed and fast target acquisition, with great FOV`s, is the right scope for that rifle.
 
Scopes like the Weaver 1-3x20,,,,, the Leupold VX3 1.5-5x20,,,,,VX2 1-4x20,,,,,Sightron Big Sky 1.25-4.5 or 5x20, the Burris 2.5x fixed, the Leupy FX2 2.5, are the best for that handi-rifle.....All are lower profiled and straight tubed scopes, all very fast and with wider FOV`s
 
The Leupolds and the Sightron offer the best eye relief! 
 
Put the right scope on there first!! 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 15:23
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the "package deal" scopes from burris arent the same quality as the burris scope that you buy by itself either.
 
 
try this maybe
 


Edited by pyro6999 - October/12/2008 at 17:11
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 17:34
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The binos that they send you aren't very high in quality **I'm being kind when I say that**.  I'd go with the above suggestions, and put the Burris on something else.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 18:06
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Ok...I may be willing to go down to a Fullfield II in 2.5-7, but that would be as low as I would even consider.  I like to leave the magnification on low setting, but increase the magnification up to high power to view horn size, body structure, age, and the like.  I have looked through low magnification scopes and they simply do not fit my bill.  Okay...back to the original question.  I see that in the Burris catalog, they say that the optimum eye relief is 3.1 to 3.7 inches while Nikon and Leupold simply state 3.6 inches or the like.  What this mean?  Does this mean that the eye will need to be positioned closer to the Burris scope when looking through the rifle on high power or does it mean if the eye is positioned anywhere between 3.1 and 3.7 inches or more, you will be able to see the entire field of view?  Does the Nikon and Leupold have a longer eye relief than the Burris from the above statements?  Most manufactures just give a single eye relief measurement instead of a range, so I am a little confused. 
 
Also, the other question from the above responses since I have another rifle (30-06) that I need to purchase a rifle scope for.  Is it true that the package deal 3-9x40 Fullfield II is not the same scope as the 3-9x40 Fullfield II that comes by itself?  I can order either one...the package deal is only about $8 or $9 dollars more.  I understand that the binoculars are the cheapest line that Burris makes, but feel like they are definately worth the $8-$9 difference.  Hell, I could probably sell them on E-bay and get some of my money back for the scope purchase.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 18:32
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I was not aware that the "package" scopes were less quality, but I'll take pyro's word on that - it makes sense that they would be lower!  As far as eye relief, some come with a "fixed" distance and some come with a "variable" distance.  If they list one, it usually means its the fixed variety.  As a note, I thought Leupolds were usually NOT fixed.  You are correct in the thought that it will be longer on lower mags and shorter on higher mags.

As to the 45/70 - how do you intend to use that rifle?  Do you think you'll be taking shots longer than 150 yds?  I'd think your 30-06 would be MUCH better at that distance!  I understand your desire to have a higher mag to "evaluate" your target, but you shouldn't really need more than 3 power to evaluate deer at the distance a 45/70 is good for IMO.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 18:46
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First off, on the Burris Fullfield 3-9x40. The eye relief which is the distance your eye is from the eyepiece is 3.8 inches at 3x power and will decrease to 3.1 inch at 9x power. I believe all scopes that dont have a constant non changing eye relief will decrease in eye relief as the power setting gets higher. I believe the Leupold VX I is the same. It has a 4.2 at lowest power and 3.6 at highest power. If Im not mistaken all Nikon scopes have a constant or very near constant eye relief that stays the same eye relief throughout the power settings. This is a very good thing because it always keeps your shooting postion the same and you wont find yourself stretching your neck forward on the stock at higher settings making you uncomfortable. As far as the Fullfield package, the combo deals are made in Phillines while the scope sold by itself is made in U.S.A . I have also been told they are different quality. The components are said to be the same but I think the coatings or glass is better on the USA model. One thing to consider is this, I believe the Burris is the only scope that has FULLY MULTI COATED LENSES, while the other two only have MULTI COATED LENSES means only the eye piece and objective lens have Multicoating while the rest of the lenses are just single coated. The more coating the better...brighter,less glare. Burris is also the only one with a solid one piece tube and saddle which means its stronger, more waterproof and the adjustments are set more solid. The Burris also has two springs holding the adjustments in place while most others only have one. One thing about the Burris is that there is no power setting knob, instead the whole eye piece housing is the power knob and you turn the whole thing to set power. If you are going to put flip open caps on it then your eye piece cap will always be in different postiions. Hope that helps more than it confuses you.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 18:59
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It is my understanding that all but the tactical Fullfield II scopes are assembled in the Philipines.  And the package scopes are 100% identical to the non-package units.  100% same components and quality
 
This is the same sort of folklore as saying guns from Walmart are different than non-Walmart guns
 
Total hogwash on both counts
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 19:13
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I believe Mr. Chris Farris him-self stated that the "packaged" scopes are not the same as the single items scopes, please correct me if I'm wrong.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 19:24
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Originally posted by lucytuma lucytuma wrote:

I believe Mr. Chris Farris him-self stated that the "packaged" scopes are not the same as the single items scopes, please correct me if I'm wrong.
that is 100% correct so anybody who believes otherwise is full of "hogwash"
and to take it one step further, i think i remember hearing something about the time when the 3x9 conquest was on sale for cheap, it was a similar type deal, but only for that one 3x9 model with that one reticle.


Edited by pyro6999 - October/12/2008 at 19:29
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 19:36
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Gonna use the 45/70 for your primitive weapons season ??? For such, If you have your heart set on  Burris, the 2-7 x35 FFII would be fine ..Eye relief shouldn't be an issue..that being said, could also try the V-series Weaver or Bushnell 3200 Elite 2x7 with Rainguard for optics of the same price point.  
 
I also understand that the package deal 3x9's  FFII's are sourced differently than the stand alone scopes. On the 06- I would look at the Primos Nikon or 4200 Elite as similarily priced options with better optics .
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 19:43
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Someone help me out here.  Does Burris have 2 production lines for the same scope?  If the ones they sell in the package deal are 'seconds' I can understand.  If they aren't then I'm confused.  Bow
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 19:55
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they arent "seconds" they are just outsourced, if you want a ffII buy the ffII by itself
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 20:05
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Originally posted by Tip69 Tip69 wrote:

I was not aware that the "package" scopes were less quality, but I'll take pyro's word on that - it makes sense that they would be lower!  As far as eye relief, some come with a "fixed" distance and some come with a "variable" distance.  If they list one, it usually means its the fixed variety.  As a note, I thought Leupolds were usually NOT fixed.  You are correct in the thought that it will be longer on lower mags and shorter on higher mags.

As to the 45/70 - how do you intend to use that rifle?  Do you think you'll be taking shots longer than 150 yds?  I'd think your 30-06 would be MUCH better at that distance!  I understand your desire to have a higher mag to "evaluate" your target, but you shouldn't really need more than 3 power to evaluate deer at the distance a 45/70 is good for IMO.

.................I`m agreeing with Tip on this one!..........A 45-70 is basically a 150 yard or less cartridge. Can go 200 yards if necessary. Properly identifying game within those ranges does not require a 7x to 9x scope on the high end to do so.  And normally, binocs are used to identify game anyway.
 
A 2x7 is still not as fast as a 1x or a 1.5x power on the low end. Your handi-rifle will become, a little less handy and slower to the target. A slower scope imo, contradicts the very definition of a handy rifle.
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 22:00
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I almost forgot we had a "package" FFII - it was on my kids 22-250.  I did not think it was a very good scope..... distortion at the edges...... and I sold it at the Tulsa Gun Show last April!  That would explain why it didn't seem to measure up to the reputation I had heard about the FFII.  I got it while I was working at a  sporting goods store and I got an employee discount.  I didn't know at the time that I could of gotten it even cheaper directly from Burris as a "Pro-Deal"   As a note - the binocs have worked out ok, nothing great, but serviceable.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 22:02
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i bought one with the spotting scope which was a piece of garbage, the scope was ok, i had it on my 300wsm for years and years and it did just fine, but yeah they outsourced that package for some reason.
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Two searchs using Chris' name and the words Burris and Fullfield has not turned up any mention of the alleged double sourcing of these scopes.  Perhaps another person posted this?  Better yet, maybe Chris will respond to this thread with the real information. 
 
Was the outsourced scope supoosed to be inferior to the Philipines produced units in either optical quality or workmanship?  Did it have the same lifetime warranty?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2008 at 22:10
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optical quality, the warranty is still the same, they arent made in the same factory, trust me chris may not have said it in the open forum but he has told quite a few of us all about it. if you dont believe us call him tomorrow morning and ask him for yourself.
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Martin...yeah we have a rule in Mississippi where if a gun was designed before 1900, has a exposed hammer, and shoots a .35 caliber or larger diameter bullet...it can be used as a primitive weapon.  The H&R Handi-Rifle meets all of the above if it is chambered in 45/70, 444 marlin, etc.  H&R has literally sold thousands of these rifles in the last couple of years here in Mississippi.  Most people are using the Handi-Rifle or the T/C Encore, but the Handi-Rifle is much more popular because of the price difference.  There are a couple of more rifles out there that also meet the above requirements.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/13/2008 at 06:49
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While I cannot elaborate as to the validity of claims in either camp, I will note that Chris will likely not respond to this for various reasons, which I'm sure all of you can understand, given his position as a dealer for Burris. I will say though that if one was to look purely at the varying optical and overall quality of the FFII line then one could definitely draw a conclusion. I have been looking at these for a couple of years now, and the rating goes from pretty nice all the way down to outright crap. So just take that for what it's worth.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/13/2008 at 07:31
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I hate it when nice old companies get bought up by corporate giants like Beretta.....and then things just go to sh*t.....my two centavos....
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/13/2008 at 09:05
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