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buis and scope mount

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 11:02
jandswyo View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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well I've posted in the mount section with no luck. Maybe someone will have an idea here. Running a YHM flip up rear sight,  mounting a Vortex 1.75-5x Diamondback. Ocular is 1.6". Buis says 3/4" folded.

Anyone have any ideas about which mounting system would provide the best solution. Of course i want it as low as possible.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 11:16
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
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Sorry for the lack of responses, I don't check the mount section, ever, maybe I should start.

I've never seen a convention scope mounted to co-witness  iron sites.  There is an issue with seeing the front site post through the optic without the proper eye relief.  There is the issue of shooting with the iron site between your face and the optic.  There is the issue of scope height.


I have seen sites mounted above magnified scopes and I have seen sites mounted below magnifying scope, but never co-witness.  I think you will have sever problems here.

I have some experience with magnifying optics for range and lasers for close-up, and with mounts that put the scope high enough up to see the irons below.

Why do you need this?

A great example of what you want to do is a Cooper Scout rifle, and those use long eye relief scopes and very simple sites - and require the scope to come off to use the irons.

With your chosen scope and your pop-up rear, you might well spend $500 on mounts only to find that it doesn't work right.

Co-witnessing with magnification will be tough.

Are you concerned the scope will fail?  You know you can use the scope tube as the rear-site aperature for use with the front site as a set of conventional irons, no pop-up needed (I run an Aimpoint this way, "just in case."  It is crude and not precise, but if it is needed, I know I can put rounds on target.

As I see it, you ahve 2 options:
Drop the rear-site ap.
Use a different scope.

Let me know if an option 3 arises and how it works for you.


Good luck.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 11:26
jandswyo View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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maybe my question was too vague...i want to mount it over the buis....
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 12:05
RONK View Drop Down
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 I just posted a response in your other thread, but will add that if it's an AR platform, mounting it 'as low as possible,' is not a good idea. Proper height is pretty high, if you want to be able to look through the scope.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 12:12
jandswyo View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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i've heard optimum height is centered at 1.4, i should be over that i believe. It is going to be mounted on 16" s&w mp15 flat-top.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 12:22
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
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My advice: forget the rear site and mount the scope as needed. 

Can you explain to me the scenario that would require iron sites on a conventionally scoped gun (dangerous game guns aside)?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 13:15
cheaptrick View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:

My advice: forget the rear site and mount the scope as needed. 
 
True that. Take it off and mount the scope.
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 17:22
Voodoo6 View Drop Down
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Now With Kung-Fu Grip!

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Why care about a BUIS with a scope any way?
Damn it ARFCOM........Evil Black Rifle
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 20:52
RONK View Drop Down
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Originally posted by jandswyo jandswyo wrote:

i've heard optimum height is centered at 1.4, i should be over that i believe. It is going to be mounted on 16" s&w mp15 flat-top.
  That is a correct height  for most people, I think. My Badger Ultra-High rings are perfect for me at 1.4".
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/03/2009 at 05:53
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I used an M4 in Iraq set up with a MATECH BUIS and an ACOG. I used the BUIS once-the day I zeroed it. The ACOG has to be removed to deploy the BUIS. Another factor was that the FSB was visible to me through the ACOG. I found it very distacting but some of my buddies were unbothered by this. I suspect you will have a similar issue, especially at lower mag settings. My personal AR's with magnified optics have gas blocks instead of the issue FSB for this reason. I have one SPR rifle that has a Leupold MR/T mounted forward of the MATECH BUIS with a gas block and a YHM flip front sight. The iorn sights are zeroed but I can't think of a scenario when they would be useful, although they do look really sexy at the range. If your optic goes down, you are likely on your way back to the truck for the wrench required to remove it. I think a spare prezeroed optic makes more sense than BUIS. As for rings, it sounds like you have the height figured out. Personally, I like aluminum rings to clamp on my aluminum upper receiver. Be very careful if you go with steel rings.

Semper Fi,

Chris
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/03/2009 at 08:42
RONK View Drop Down
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(QUOTE) If  your optic goes down you are likely on your way back to the truck for the wrench required to remove it. (QUOTE)
 True Dat!
Somebody will probably soon develop and market a holder that mounts on a Picatinny rail to hold the wrench you would need to remove the ACOG to use the BUIS!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/03/2009 at 10:21
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
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Probably the best mount for a scope on a rifle using BUIS would be a La Rue quick detachable scope mount.  Obviously if you are installing the BUIS in the correct position to be used upon removal of the optic you have clearance issues. While some BUIS lay lower than others it is sometimes a hit and miss guesswork figuring out what works with what. ARMS also mades quick detachable mounts to work in conjunction with their BUIS but the La Rue is tougher. If installing a BUIS I would not go with Badger Ordnance rings because they are ment to stay put not to come on and off.  One other possible is the GG&G quick detachable mount.
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Here the idea is you go with a quick detachable riser add medium or high rings etc to adjust height for clearance.  All three companies make a set up like this.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/03/2009 at 14:28
jandswyo View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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I'm leaning now more towards the riser/rings. The RRA mount looks and "measures" like it would work but can get no idea if they have it in stock or not or when they would be in stock, as they don't seem to check email, and can't get through on the phone.
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