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Buckmark Pistol, 2X, 2-hand grip wobble

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/07/2007 at 07:25
cowno2 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


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I am a plinker and generalist shooter who shoots at indoor ranges and outdoor ranges. I punch paper at 25 feet, shoot cans at 25 and 50 yards, and sometimes rest my Buckmark pistol and try to hit small targets at 100 yards.

 

I do not take bullseye shooting seriously and almost always shoot with a two-hand grip. I do not hunt, so target aquisition speed is not a concern. I have 53-year-old eyes, so I need to get the target and the sights on the same plane, preferably with one-eye sighting. I like precision too.

 

Given the above, I decided to go with the Nikon EER Monarch 2X x 20 instead of a red dot. I actually look at the added weight of a scope versus a red dot as a benefit in reducing recoil (Buckmark Target 5.5 and Nikon scope = 43 ounces). I also like the look of a full size scope on a pistol. The look is formidable.

 

Anyway, I was wondering, with a 43 ounce setup and a two-handed grip, how much wobble can I expect on a target that is 25 feet away? My guess is it will not be a objectionable. The actual magnification of the Nikon 2X is 1.75X according to Chuck Hawks.

Can someone with lots of scope shooting expereince share their comments?

 

Thanks.

 

I am new to the forum. Now that my eyes are getting older, I think I am going to be moving to optics.

 

Regards,

 

Tom

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/07/2007 at 10:00
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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the wobble is the same -- to minimize use a strong weaver stance pushing the gun out with the right, and pulling back with the left, wrist and elbow should be in same line with reticle. at 25 feet you should be shooting in the same hole if the brand is compatible to that gun. 25 yd groups should be about a quarter. try not to close the left eye but approach the target in one motion. now one hand is another story.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/07/2007 at 10:28
cowno2 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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Hi Dale,

 

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and providing a description of the performance I can expect.

 

If I can get that kind of accuracy, I will be very happy. The Buckmark shoots great with iron sights, so I hope the scope will help me shoot it better.

 

I guess I could have worded my question better. I understand that the wobble will be the same no matter what type of sights I use. I was wondering about magnification of the wobble with a 2X scope versus the 1X (no) magnification of most red dots. Some people have suggested 2X scopes can be frustrating to use because you can't hold steady on the target. My thinking was a 1.75X magnification and a two-hand grip on a heavy gun should allow me to hold right on with no exaggerated wobble due to magnification.

 

Your response suggests the scope should work well. Thanks again.

 

Regards,

 

Tom  

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/07/2007 at 10:43
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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the use of the weaver pretty much eliminates because the center axix of the shoulders is in front of the hips and you are not counterbalancing the gun by leaning back such as NRA bullseye. the leaning back causes most of the wobble.

 

use a 2x leo all the time you will love the set up

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/07/2007 at 12:27
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/07/2007 at 12:59
cowno2 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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Hi Dale,

 

Good link. Thanks. I have Brian Enos' book, "Practical Shooting, Beyond the Fundamentals" and I like his "Zen" approach of being aware of everything that happens when you shoot . . . and learning from that awareness.

 

By the way, I like your S&W 41. About two week ago, I rented and shot one at the Smith and Wesson range in Springfield. You could feel the quality of the design, materials, and manufacturing.

 

I am anxiously awaiting the delivery of the scope.

 

If you have time for another question . . . I am planning to mount the scope, go the range, see where it hits, and then adjust windage and elevation accordingly. It the standard procedure for sighting in? Any tips here?

 

Regards,

 

Tom

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/07/2007 at 13:58
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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sometimes on autos one can take the barrel off as in the case of the 41 and simply look down the barrel and align the reticle, I think the buck will do the same. save a few rounds and gets it on paper. after that it is a matter of getting the gun on a rock solid rest , which is really frustrating sometimes because one doesn't know until later if one is working with the most accurate loads in that gun. You can do it the other way around if you want, see how it groups with a variety disregarding the point of impact, selecting the most accurate and consistent then "center" the recticle. your gun will be capable of 12 ga hulls at 50 yds.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/08/2007 at 14:12
cowno2 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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Thanks for the help Dale. I just ordered some Caldwell sand bag rests today so hopefully I will steady as a rock. 

 

Regards,

 

Tom

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/08/2007 at 19:09
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/08/2007 at 20:12
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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when the ransom rests became available in the 80 we tested these at a local gun club in colorado extensively. the club was a really into international metallic handgun silhoutte and several of the members were national champions. while the ransom proved useful several of the members could out shot the rest from the creedmore position. and it was also found that guns having slides (autos) would not return to battery consistently enough and some of the guys were out shooting the ransom from solid sandbags. I'm sure that ransom has corrected this problem, but it still requires a seperate set of grip handles for each  gun used in their testing. a recent study done by members of brianenos.com in determing the effects of porting on pistols raised serious doubts in the using of the ransom for recoil measurement. in all fairness the rest was never designed for this. but thought you might be interested

has anyone else experience with ransoms?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/09/2007 at 19:54
cowno2 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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Quick Followup.

 

Below is a low res photo of the Nikon on my Buckmark.

 

I am totally impressed with the qualilty of the scope. I have not shot it yet, but from looking through it, I can see this is going to be a bright, beautiful, and accurate experience.

 

The sighting problem with my "old" eyes is over. (But now I have no excuses when I shoot bad.)

 

Thanks again for the advice Dale.

 

Tom

 

 

 

 

 

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