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Bergers in a detachable magazine?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 10:40
huff143 View Drop Down
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I'd like to try some 140 or 150 VLD's in my Tikka .270WSM but have heard that the VLD's don't fit in some detachable magazines. 
I figured I'd ask if anyone has tried them yet before I drop the money on a whole box of bullets.  I'd hate like heck to find out they won't fit and wind up with a box of useless copper coated lead.
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 10:50
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A bullet is a bullet as long as you don't exceed the allowable space in which it fits in the magazine you will be fine. seating depth is the key.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 10:58
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Yeah, I was just concerned with the "jump" to the ogive.  I know those suckers have some really long noses.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 11:18
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I'd be more concerned with setting depth issues.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 12:39
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Originally posted by silver silver wrote:

I'd be more concerned with setting depth issues.
 
 
That's basically what I was talking about.  Are ya referring to not having enough room for the powder?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 13:14
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these bullets aren't much longer than those of Hornady's or Barnes unless you are using MAX loads with powders that fill to capacity there should be no concerns. though you generally get better results from such said loads it dos not always hold true, just experiment a little and if you find they are not to your liking I bet you could get rid of them very easily!

ps. these bullets do have long noses but the ogive is way back. long noses contact nothing but the magazine.


Edited by rifle looney - May/16/2009 at 13:16
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 17:01
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Originally posted by rifle looney rifle looney wrote:

these bullets aren't much longer than those of Hornady's or Barnes unless you are using MAX loads with powders that fill to capacity there should be no concerns. though you generally get better results from such said loads it dos not always hold true, just experiment a little and if you find they are not to your liking I bet you could get rid of them very easily!

ps. these bullets do have long noses but the ogive is way back. long noses contact nothing but the magazine.
 
Looney,
 
I'll probably stick with Reloader 19, as I've had great luck with it in this rifle.  Do you know how close the case would be to full with a load approaching max grains?
It's really only the contact with the magazine that concerns me for now.  The mag is plastic and I can shave a little bit off the inside of it if I need to; just don't know if that'll be enough. Whacko
 
Thanks.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 17:09
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I don't have an answer for that but if you can get or ask the new Nosler reloading manual will list that as case capacity volume. I only have manual # 4 and it has no short mags listed and as far as taking material from the magazine this is done a lot on different applications where there is enough to remove and it wont be all that much but it could make the difference. I have done this on my 300 mag and it help my situation.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 18:15
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Originally posted by huff143 huff143 wrote:

I'd like to try some 140 or 150 VLD's in my Tikka .270WSM but have heard that the VLD's don't fit in some detachable magazines. 
I figured I'd ask if anyone has tried them yet before I drop the money on a whole box of bullets.  I'd hate like heck to find out they won't fit and wind up with a box of useless copper coated lead.
 
........... In your case, you begin to seat them to the maximum allowable COAL your detachable magazine will allow while still enabling you to cycle the bolt effectively. You should also experiment with different powders, seating depths and hope for the best.
 
My Ruger 300 WSM magazine`s (a non-detachable magazine) max length is 2.920." The 270 WSM has the same COAL as the 300 WSM. Without touching the rifling, my COAL using the hunting VLDs is 2.900" or less depending on the bullet weight I`m using. For range use only, I could seat them out a little further.
 
If you don`t buy the bullets and try some, you`ll never know!
 
If you are able to find your rifle`s sweet spot for seating depth, the VLDs are an extremely accurate, flat flying bullet, and a devastating bullet on game.
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 19:12
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This is all good advice.  Thanks much!
I think I'll proceed with the 150 VLDs and see what happens.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 19:27
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X = 180 Y = 90 (X+Pyro)+(Y-Pyro) = ?

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My data from berger shows:

 62.6gr. max for 130 gr.  97.9% load density
61.1gr. max for 140gr.    96.4% load density
60.0gr. max for 150gr.     94.6% load density
for RL-19 With OAL of 2.860
(I think that stands for Rifle Looney #19Bucky)
 
I would fill a case with a max load, and see how full it is. I'm betting that a Berger that will clear the magazine will be seated down close to the bottom of the shoulder. I never tried them in my .270 WSM, but am running them in a .300 Wby, and tried Hornady SST's in my WSM, and they are long too. I never had any trouble getting them to work with IMR 7828. I would bet that they'll work for you.


Edited by trigger29 - May/16/2009 at 19:33
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 19:38
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Thanks for the numbers, Trigger. 
I'll go ahead and get a box of them and try one.  As long as it fits, I'll send a couple of fired brass and a test bullet to Lee to have a collet made just for it to size the necks.  Then, load some and go boom-boom!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 19:52
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X = 180 Y = 90 (X+Pyro)+(Y-Pyro) = ?

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Any time man. I hope they work out for you. I've taken them up for my longer range work with my .300. Unfortunately they shoot so well, that I shoot them for the short range stuff too. That's too badCool.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2009 at 20:43
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the only thing is though trigger, is that you have a weatherby chambering with a long throat, so you have some room to play where the op may not
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/17/2009 at 01:40
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Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

the only thing is though trigger, is that you have a weatherby chambering with a long throat, so you have some room to play where the op may not
 
 
If my mind serves me right, the factory listed COAL for a .270WSM is 2.860".  My loads with 140gr Sierra GameKings measure 2.920".  Last weekend it punched a three-shot group of 0.326" @ 100yds.  But, I want to try the other bullets to see how it'll do in the wind at much greater distances.
I suppose my point here is that my Tikka likes long loads, so I'm guessing there will be plenty of room in the throat for the VLD's?
 


Edited by huff143 - May/17/2009 at 01:42
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/17/2009 at 10:18
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while thats all good and well im guessing that the bergers will push you past 3.000" coal, at some point you will run out of room, those berger bullets will be longer than the gamekings are for sure. i take it you are interested in loading more than one at a time into the rifle?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/17/2009 at 12:49
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If he's not trying to load to the lands, he will probably be fine. The info that I gave was from my .270 Wsm, not my Weatherby chambering. My WSM had a long enough magazine to load long bullets and still have plenty of room for powder. I used much slower powder in mine, and never had a problem. You will never get the velocity out of a 150 gr. Berger that the ammo companies claim they get with a 150 though. According to my chrono though, they don't get that velocity either.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/17/2009 at 14:19
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Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

while thats all good and well im guessing that the bergers will push you past 3.000" coal, at some point you will run out of room, those berger bullets will be longer than the gamekings are for sure. i take it you are interested in loading more than one at a time into the rifle?
 
This is a hunting rifle, so yes, the magazine is a must. 
 
I've heard some rifles shooting these bullets like a lot of jump before they get into the rifling.  Anybody else heard this?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/17/2009 at 20:01
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Originally posted by huff143 huff143 wrote:

Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

while thats all good and well im guessing that the bergers will push you past 3.000" coal, at some point you will run out of room, those berger bullets will be longer than the gamekings are for sure. i take it you are interested in loading more than one at a time into the rifle?
 
This is a hunting rifle, so yes, the magazine is a must. 
 
I've heard some rifles shooting these bullets like a lot of jump before they get into the rifling.  Anybody else heard this?
..............Yes and no!! The amount of bullet jump (for best accuracy) using the Bergers, will depend on what YOUR rifle or any individual rifle prefers.
 
Berger will tell you to try various seating depths for best accuracy. However for hunting loads, start first with the maximum COAL length that your magazine can handle while cycling the bolt effectively and work down in length from there to see which delivers the best accuracy.
 
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/17/2009 at 22:24
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I would start at magazine length, and back them up in .015-.020 increments and see which shoots best. Try them with a couple powders, and charges. Something will shoot good, then you can tweak from there.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/17/2009 at 22:48
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Huff since you are in Kansas City why dont you drop by GA Precision and ask George Gardner  http://www.gaprecision.net/menu.html  He chambers some of his hunting rifles in 270WSM and I'm sure he could guide you toward an accurate load. Probably measure the chamber and tell you what length to load them.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/18/2009 at 08:23
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Stop thinking to much into this. Just load 5 of them 3.0 grains lower than max charge and to mag length and go shoot. If they shot well then you have a good load if not go up 0.5grains and load them again to max mag length and go shoot again. If not to your liking go up another 0.5gr and try it again. I bet you will find they shoot really well. I use them in a few of my rifles and none are loaded to the lands but to mag length.

 

 
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