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Ballistic Reticles

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/19/2009 at 21:46
Bboy623 View Drop Down
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Can someone advise how the ballistic reticles work? I understand the concept but after considering a Monarch with BDC I've changed my mind..on the BDC and probably Nikon. How do the Conquest ballistic reticles work? What about Swarovski American riflescopes ballictic reticles??
 
What I am wanting is a scope that I can sight in at 100 yards and the marks below the main cross hairs are DEAD on at 200, 300, etc out to about 500 yards. After researching the BDC Nikons I found that the "circles" were merely a guessing game. Sometimes it would be the center of the circle, sometimes the top and sometimes the bottom. I like the Swarovski ballistic reticle the best. Who has them? Who likes them? Will it do what I am wanting to do?--Bboy623
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/19/2009 at 23:08
sakomato View Drop Down
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What is your caliber and budget?
 
The reason I ask is that some ballistic reticles work well with certain trajectories.
 
I have a Conquest RapidZ 800 and the way you figure out how to use the reticle is to go to their website and work your way through the RapidZ calculator.  That will tell you what power to set the scope on to make the hash marks coordinate with your trajectory.  For me on a 6.5 rem mag shooting a 130 gr Scirrocco at 3100 fps the power needs to be set on 13.34 and it will theoretically fit.  In my shooting to 600 yards it is very close.
 
I have a Burris ballistic mil dot and that works with a 22-250 shooting a 55 gr bullet at 3640 fps.
 
I have worked with a Burris ballistic plex and that works with some bullets in some calibers depending upon which bullet you are shooting and how fast.
 
I have a Kahles TDS on a 30-06 and shoot a 200 gr Accubond and it fits the trajectory very close.  However there are some bullets that I can not shoot because they just don't fit.
 
I have 2 of the Kahle MultiZero scopes and can set the marks to match whatever trajectory I want.  These obviously work the best because I can put them on any rifle shooting any bullet and move the marks to match the trajectory.
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/20/2009 at 08:56
Bboy623 View Drop Down
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Caliber is .270 Win...on a Browning BAR Safari. Budget is undetermined at this point and time. I'm not going $1,000 and up but may go to $650 or so. I shoot Remington Core Lock 150gr right now and was thinking of going down to the 130gr. If you can advise on a different brand bullet taht work better, I'm all ears. I have have good luck with the Rems though, but ballisticly I think the 130s are better. I need a scope that has EXCELLENT low light capabilities as the deer come out in the last 30 minutes of legal hunting time which is after sunset. I was going to go Monarch but am reconsidering after everyone says teh Conquest is better....and I don't want to spend $400-450 on a Monarch and be unhappy when I could have spent just a little more and have a scope of a lifetime. I am most impressed with Meopta. I can get the R1 for about $650 and it is a 30mm scope and optics are truely amazing to me. I'd like to get 30mm scope for the low light capibility. I'd liek to have a ballistic reticle as sometimes the deer are 100-150 yards out...(no problem)...and sometimes they are 250-300 yards away. I am confident in my shooting capabilites that I can make an ethical shot if I can see them and know what my gun is going to do at that distance; thus the need for a ballistic reticle. Unless you think a ballistic reticle is unnecessary for a .270 and i just need to sight it in at a certain yardage to be able to take close and far away deer. Thanks for you imput and help----Bboy623
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/20/2009 at 14:19
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I just have two words for you… (well maybe 12.. Nightforce Velocity)
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/20/2009 at 20:19
sakomato View Drop Down
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Okay so you have a 270 (excellent caliber BTW, just ask pyro Big Grin) and you want to shoot at 250 to 300 yards.  That is important because the ballistic reticles are not really necessary or even that useful until you get to 400 yards or more. 
 
For a 300 yard shot a 6" holdover will do the job but if you're like me I like the thought that if I wanted to shoot something further then I could give it a shot as long as I have practiced at those ranges.  It then becomes necessary to also have a range finder because at the extended ranges a small mistake in estimating range can cause a miss even if you have a ballistic reticle.
 
I think you have a misconception about the light gathering ability comparison of a 1" and 30mm scope.  The 1" scope can be just as bright as the 30mm depending upon other factors.  Some scope manufacturers put 1" size glass in their 30mm scopes to fool the consumer (most notably Leupold) and the 30mm's got the reputation for light gathering mainly because they used to have superior European glass.  Now you can get excellent glass in a 1" tube in several different places.
 
Speaking from personal experience and stating my opinion of my own optics I would say the following:
 
  • If you want to shoot long distance (over 300) then you need the higher powers such as 12 power +, if you just need a hunting scope then a 9 or 10 power is sufficient and will have a larger field of view which helps in a hunting situation with a running shot or close quarters work
  • There is a difference between "brightness" and "clarity".  I would say that my $1500 Zeiss Diavari V 2.5x10x50 and my Kahles 4x12x52 MultiZeros are very very slightly brighter than my Zeiss Conquest 4.5x14x44 but my Conquest and several other Conquests I have installed on friends' rifles have amazing clarity.  That means that when you need to see 22 caliber holes on white paper in a 300 yard target, grab the Conquest cause you just can't quite see them with any other scope I have tried.

Now if you go to the Zeiss website and put in the ballistics for a 140 gr Accubond bullet traveling at 3000 fps (easily doable in the 270) it will show that when you zero that bullet at 200 yards then the reticle will be dead on out to 600 yards at 10 power with the 10 power scope or at 9 power with the 9 power scope.  You can't get much better than that.

That leaves a choice of which power, the 3x9x50
 
 
or the 3.5x10x50
 
 
The 50 mm objective will gather the most light and give a slightly better field of view.  You will have to mount the 50 mm objective a little higher on the rifle and if that is a concern then the 40 mm or 44 mm objective will do just fine but gather less light.
 
If it were me I would get the 3x9x50 Conquest and like I say I have tried them all except the Leupold reticles.


Edited by sakomato - August/20/2009 at 20:25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/21/2009 at 09:53
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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most of the reticles use a sighting in range of 200 yds. If you know the bullet drop between 200 and 300 yds for your load (from a ballistic program) you can use the reticle for ranging with the swaros, zeiss has 2 moa marks at the top of the grid, and leo uses a change in the variable power (has a mark on the power ring ) for determing range.
the problem you bring up about using the top,bottom or middle of the reticle is present with all the reticles because the entire hold over reticle system is built around the cone of fire for any given ballistic profile. If you use a center of mass hold on the target, other problems arise. Backing up a bit--- most military and le (also 3 gun steel shooters) are taught to use a center of mass aim such that off center hits relays imformation about the strike by how the target reacts. This allows for rapid sighting target corrections. This is mostly why they prefer dial in. It gives the impression of a more precise target hold. However it also depends on the accuracy of the target ranged. Mildot is good for about 5% error of the target distance and lasers are less than 1%. Hold over reticles act to average. The makers are saying that if the cone of fire is between such and such for a given ballistic profile the hash mark will be good for say 20 yds, in front of the shot and 20 yds behind the shot. If you accept a larger cone of fire the front and back strike ranges become say 30 yds.
Once you get this down, you can manipulate the inputs to accomplish your goal. As an example I use a z6 2x12 on a flat shooting 7mm. But the beauty of the z6 is its lack of distortion in the lower variable range thus 2 thru 8. I want this set up for deep closed cover elk hunting, on 2-4 power and if necessay go to 500 yds for that canyon shot. By backing off the velocity a bit it was possible to use the online swaro computer to adjust the main reticle to 100 yds , 2nd bar to 200 etc. thru the power range. Why not just get a ffp? No ffp scope made has the z6s low end zoom capabilites. Also it does away with any need for laser accuracy ranging (or other time options) as the shot will never be past 500 yds, (even that needs a perfect set up).
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