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Annealing your casing Necks

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2009 at 18:17
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Alright guys, looking for info on how to and how often to anneal my casing necks for 270 Win and 308 as well!

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Bud, Have a look here.  http://www.6mmbr.com/annealing.html

If you are like me, you will decide that annealing cases is too much of a pain in the butt and just buy new cases.  But if ya gotta do it, the linked page pretty much lays out how to do it correctly.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2009 at 19:55
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Originally posted by Texas Texas wrote:

Bud, Have a look here.  http://www.6mmbr.com/annealing.html

If you are like me, you will decide that annealing cases is too much of a pain in the butt and just buy new cases.  But if ya gotta do it, the linked page pretty much lays out how to do it correctly.
 
Regards,
 
Texas


This is a good answer!   Excellent
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2009 at 20:35
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Everybody JOHN BARSNESS just posted this over on the Case Life string.  Thanks John!
 

Sorry I didn't get back on the annealing thing sooner.

I use a method perfected by my friend Fred Barker, who writes for some gun magazines, including Precion Shooting. Fred found that the normal annealing methods used for years made the necks too soft, as they normally involved heating the brass to red-hot then quenching in water.

Fred is a retired metallurgist and developed the following:

1) Light a standard wax candle.

2) Hold the case halfway up the body with the tips of your fingers.

3) Heat the neck in the tip of the candle flame until the case is too hot to hold.

4) Wipe the front end of the ecase with a wet towel (paper towel will do) which finishes the annealing process AND cleans off the candle-flame soot.

I do it with any lot of brass as soon as the necks start feeling stiffer when resizing, or if one cracks. It also helps after making wildcat rounds after necking up or down.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2009 at 22:15
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Originally posted by budperm budperm wrote:

Everybody JOHN BARSNESS just posted this over on the Case Life string.  Thanks John!
 

Sorry I didn't get back on the annealing thing sooner.

I use a method perfected by my friend Fred Barker, who writes for some gun magazines, including Precion Shooting. Fred found that the normal annealing methods used for years made the necks too soft, as they normally involved heating the brass to red-hot then quenching in water.

Fred is a retired metallurgist and developed the following:

1) Light a standard wax candle.

2) Hold the case halfway up the body with the tips of your fingers.

3) Heat the neck in the tip of the candle flame until the case is too hot to hold.

4) Wipe the front end of the ecase with a wet towel (paper towel will do) which finishes the annealing process AND cleans off the candle-flame soot.

I do it with any lot of brass as soon as the necks start feeling stiffer when resizing, or if one cracks. It also helps after making wildcat rounds after necking up or down.


i use a benz o matic torch and a pan of water and with my 6.5 rem mag i have had to anneal every case i owned before its second firing, what a pain the ass and the fingers.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/15/2009 at 09:20
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Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

i use a benz o matic torch and a pan of water and with my 6.5 rem mag i have had to anneal every case i owned before its second firing, what a pain the ass and the fingers.
 
Pyro, why did the 6.5 brass get so hard in one firing?  Rem brass usually starts pretty soft, do you think the 6.5 mag brass is different?
 
Texas
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I bought one of the Hornady annealing kits and it seems to work very well.  I have loaded a few winchester brass now 8 times annealing every 3rd firing and it still seems to be doing well with neck tension, and I have had no split necks. 

It has these attachments that you chuck up in your drill, that way you know you are annealing them evenly.
It comes with a chemical that you can put on the brass and it melts when your brass hits the right temp.  I just use it on the first couple of each annealing session and count how many seconds it took to melt with my torch temp and then just count to that for the rest of my brass. 


Edited by supertool73 - March/15/2009 at 21:17
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 08:27
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Originally posted by Texas Texas wrote:

Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

i use a benz o matic torch and a pan of water and with my 6.5 rem mag i have had to anneal every case i owned before its second firing, what a pain the ass and the fingers.
 
Pyro, why did the 6.5 brass get so hard in one firing?  Rem brass usually starts pretty soft, do you think the 6.5 mag brass is different?
 
Texas

it was hard when i bought it, i dont know if remington had a bad batch of brass when they made those cases or what, but i bought like 300 brand new pieces of brass and after about the first 10 i shoot split the neck i went hmmm. they looked different too, i cant really explain it well, but they were that smooth glossy finish you would normally see. the case i got looked more like a rough dull finish, i could suspect its because they probably sat on shelves for 3 decades. i doubt that was the real problem, after i annealed them i never had any more trouble.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 09:02
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I did a bit of annealing and decided it is not worth the effort. I saw this recipe that uses molten lead. The molten lead is at exactly the right temp for annealing brass. Just dip the case mouth in a bit of oil to prevent the lead sticking and stick part you want to anneal into molten lead.(yes the oil burns on touching the lead, but it makes the whole process so much more exciting. Wear welders cloves and make sure the missus is watching you. All the flames and the gloves really impresses her!)
Then count 10 secs and toss the case into cold water.
But I would rather just buy new brass.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 09:06
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the problem in my case was that every bag i bought was that way except for one, and my brass came from 3-4 different places so it wasnt like i bought all of it from one place. 6.5rem brass can be hard to come by, and in a lot of cases its fairly expensive too. my .264win mag cases are cheaper than the 6.5s were.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 09:44
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Pyro - how do you anneal with the pan of water?  Sit them upright I assume but how much water and how long do you heat them?  Have some Winchester brass that was splitting on the shoulder.  Talked to Win and they thought it was an annealing issue as well.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 09:50
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i actually use a bucket, like a 2-3 gallon one, and i fill it with enough water to cover the case if it were standing, it gets old after about the second case you have to do. your fingers will hate you for it, but it works.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 10:00
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So you hold them by hand, heat with the torch and once fingers hurt drop them in water?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 10:03
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correct, i grab the case at the base and basically twist the case back and forth in the flame to ensure i get 360 degrees of heating and when i cant hold it any more i drop it into the bucket. the thing to remember is that if you have tough hands you may hold onto the cases to long which isnt good either. you dont want them to be red hot, in my case i knew when they were ready it was like getting shocked. the pain hit you just bam instant pain and you will probably cuss as i did just as you let go.

Edited by pyro6999 - March/16/2009 at 10:16
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 10:55
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I just hold mine with tongs and roll them around the heat for about 20 seconds and drop them in the water.
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i dont think it took 20 seconds for me, course i dont know what kind of heat those torches put out either, so that may have something to do with it, the reason to hold them by hand (i was told this by an old blacksmith/ gun nut) was supposedly when your fingers got that hot that far away from the neck you were just right.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 11:09
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he might be right. the few I have done worked out but The heat was not realy close ether.I guess we are going to the same place just took a different road getting there.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 11:14
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Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

i dont think it took 20 seconds for me, course i dont know what kind of heat those torches put out either, so that may have something to do with it, the reason to hold them by hand (i was told this by an old blacksmith/ gun nut) was supposedly when your fingers got that hot that far away from the neck you were just right.



Some of those old heads actually knew stuff they didn't teach in school!!!   Thunbs Up
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 11:17
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well he was the one who figured out my problems, i talked to all kinds of people who i figured would know. he just happened to be a person we do some dirt work for from time to time, and the light bulb clicked on in my head one day and i called him up and said "al ive got a problem with some brass and here is what's going on here is how they look etc.. etc.." and he was like oh thats easy, brittle brass is easy to fix and he told me what to do. i was happy as pig in sh*t then, and like i said no more problems.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 11:33
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This guy I know whom has a FFL and I have guns sent to him occasionally tried to tell me one day that firing a round got them hot enough to anneal them.  So they were getting annealed every time you shot them.  I said well then why can I grab a .308 case that just came out of my gun and hold it in my hand without it burning me.  He said because they cool rapidly.  Whatever
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 11:40
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Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

This guy I know whom has a FFL and I have guns sent to him occasionally tried to tell me one day that firing a round got them hot enough to anneal them.  So they were getting annealed every time you shot them.  I said well then why can I grab a .308 case that just came out of my gun and hold it in my hand without it burning me.  He said because they cool rapidly.  Whatever

and im sure as you figured out on your own he is way wrong.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 12:59
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I figured once I know how long it took to get the brass hot to my fingers that I would then start using a different devise to hold the brass, keep everything else the same and save the BBQ for the grill. Wink
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that would be nice, i did notice that for some reason not all cases heated up the same, of course that could have to do with my proximity to the flame too. i hope i dont have to do it by hand ever again i can tell you that.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2009 at 16:06
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Do you not anneal often or did you find a different way?
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