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Aimpoint Works Useless for Co-Witnessing

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/13/2006 at 07:10
valleypine View Drop Down
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I just purchased and received what's called the Aimpoint Works, which consists of an Aimpoint Rail Grabber, Forward Carry Handle Mount and Spacer (used only on flattops). I was led to believe that this mounting package was specifically designed to allow co-witnessing of an Aimpoint 1X site on an AR-15 fixed carry handle. When I mounted my Aimpoint Comp C site on my fixed carry handle Colt Lightweight Sporter, the Rail Grabber placed the sight so high that the bottom lip of the sight obscured the front fixed sight when looking through the rear peep. As an additional check, I laid a pencil in the forward carry handle sight channel horizontally aligned with the rear peep. The pencil point touched the bottom of the sight lip, proving that the rail grabber places the sight too high for co-witnessing with the iron sights. To make matters worse, you can't even mount the standard Aimpoint mount which comes with the sight on the forward carry handle mount because it places the sight too close to the carry handle and won't allow clearance to mount the sight.         

 

From my experience, the Aimpoint Works package is useless if you want to co-witness an Aimpoint with your iron sights. I would never recommend this piece of garbage. 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/13/2006 at 17:07
Brady View Drop Down
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When you mounted your aimpoint with the carry handle mount and railgrabber could you see any of your front sight through the peep sight? If so then the setup worked exactly as intended. We have sold hundreds if not thousands of this same package of mounts with very very few problems. The problems people come across are problems of improper mounting and/or mounting correctly and just not educated as to what co-witnessed really means. If you can see your iron sights through the scope no matter where the iron sights are in your sight picture, then you are co-witnessed. I mounted this exact same set up on a fixed carry handle AR15 here and had no problems what so ever.

 

Plus a lot depends on where your factory iron sights are sighted in at whether or not you will be able to co-witness.

 

The ring provided with the scopes was never designed to be used on the 10174 forward carry handle mount. It's just simply a basic 30mm ring for basic mounting use. The 10174 carry handle mount will only mount an Aimpoint with the QRP 568059 railgrabber ring as you have found out. This is why the railgrabber ring is part of the works and not the basic 30mm ring that came with your scope.

 

In my experiences the package works exactly as designed.

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2006 at 07:16
valleypine View Drop Down
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Brady,

 

Thanks for the response. Answers below.

 

When you mounted your aimpoint with the carry handle mount and railgrabber could you see any of your front sight through the peep sight? (With the carry handle and railgrabber installed, but not the Aimpoint sight, looking through the rear peep I could see the top half of the front sight. With the Aimpoint sight installed and looking through the rear peep, I couldn't see any of the front sight. If I lifted my head off of the stock without looking through the rear peep and with a lousy cheek weld I could barely see the top 1/4 of the front sight at the very bottom of the Aimpoint field of view.) If so then the setup worked exactly as intended. We have sold hundreds if not thousands of this same package of mounts with very very few problems. The problems people come across are problems of improper mounting and/or mounting correctly and just not educated as to what co-witnessed really means. (I took the carry handle mount off several times and re-installed it to make sure it was properly installed. It appeared properly installed because the extended part of the carry handle was parallel with the front handguard, i.e., not canted.)  If you can see your iron sights through the scope no matter where the iron sights are in your sight picture, then you are co-witnessed. I mounted this exact same set up on a fixed carry handle AR15 here and had no problems what so ever.

 

Plus a lot depends on where your factory iron sights are sighted in at whether or not you will be able to co-witness. (The factory iron sights are sighted in for 225 yards, which is the standard distance for 5.56 on an AR-15.) 

 

The ring provided with the scopes was never designed to be used on the 10174 forward carry handle mount. It's just simply a basic 30mm ring for basic mounting use. The 10174 carry handle mount will only mount an Aimpoint with the QRP 568059 railgrabber ring as you have found out. This is why the railgrabber ring is part of the works and not the basic 30mm ring that came with your scope. (I fully understand this. I placed the Aimpoint mounted with it's standard mount on the carry handle mount only to see what the field of view would be. With the standard Aimpoint mount, the front iron sight was approximately dead center when looking through the rear peep. This showed that if the height of the rails grabber ring was the same height as the standard mount ring, I wouldn't have had any problem.)  

 

In my experiences the package works exactly as designed.

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/14/2006 at 08:45
valleypine View Drop Down
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Brady,

 

I got a little emotionally carried away and apologize for disparaging Aimpoint on this. I'm sure this mounting system works for the majority of those who use it. Otherwise it wouldn't be sold. I'm probably one of the few where it didn't work for whatever reason. 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/19/2006 at 14:13
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I've never seen an instance where this combination didn't work as intended.  Please give us a call so that we can discuss specifics.

 

Mike.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/19/2006 at 14:43
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Welcome to The OT, Aimpoint!!

 

Glad your here.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/19/2006 at 14:50
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Glad to be here!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/20/2006 at 13:02
valleypine View Drop Down
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Originally posted by aimpoint aimpoint wrote:

I've never seen an instance where this combination didn't work as intended.  Please give us a call so that we can discuss specifics.

 

Mike.

 

Mike,

 

I contacted Aimpoint technical support per your suggestion. We were unable to come up with a definitive answer to the problem.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/20/2006 at 13:05
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Have you zeroed the Aimpoint sight?  Is the obstruction of your view of the front sight caused by part of the external body of the sight or by some internal part?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 06:35
valleypine View Drop Down
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Originally posted by aimpoint aimpoint wrote:

Have you zeroed the Aimpoint sight?  Is the obstruction of your view of the front sight caused by part of the external body of the sight or by some internal part?

 

Aimpoint,

 

I didn't zero the Aimpoint because the mount was purchased brand new and I wouldn't be able to return it if there was any sign of use. I have subsequently returned it.

 

The obstruction was caused by the external part of the site (the metal lip directly below the lower part of the lens). Looking through the rear peep I see the above (the metal lip directly below the lower part of the lens). To even see the top of the front sight at all, I have to lift my head off the stock and look down at an angle through the lens. 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 07:48
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Were you using the spacer with the mount?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 09:51
valleypine View Drop Down
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Originally posted by aimpoint aimpoint wrote:

Were you using the spacer with the mount?

 

Aimpoint,

 

I was not using the spacer. However, if I was using the spacer this would make the problem worse. The sight needs to go lower, not higher.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 09:58
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Optics GrassHopper
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I understand.  I just figured that the question needed to be asked so I could rule that out.  This is all extremely puzzling.  These are the same pieces of mounting hardware that we've been supplying to the Army since 1997 with no problems.  Obviously, the Army hasn't used all of the monts for the A2s, but we've shipped almost 400,000 of them, so if there was a problem, we'd have heard about it.

 

Just out of curiosity, can you tell me exactly what rifle you are using?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 09:59
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Sorry, going back, I see that it's a Colt Lightweight Sporter.  Is the carry Handle on that rifle fixed or detachable?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 10:27
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Originally posted by aimpoint aimpoint wrote:

Sorry, going back, I see that it's a Colt Lightweight Sporter.  Is the carry Handle on that rifle fixed or detachable?

 

Aimpoint,

 

I misquoted it as being a Colt Lightweight Sporter. It's a Colt Match Target Lightweight MT6530 with fixed carry handle.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 10:36
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I assumed it was a fixed-handle gun after looking at the earlier posts, but the symptoms match what would happen with a detachable carry handle.  I'm still stumped!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 11:15
valleypine View Drop Down
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Originally posted by aimpoint aimpoint wrote:

I assumed it was a fixed-handle gun after looking at the earlier posts, but the symptoms match what would happen with a detachable carry handle.  I'm still stumped!

 

Aimpoint,

 

Just out of curiosity, why would this happen with a detachable carry handle?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 11:55
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The hole is not in the same place, so if you get the mount attached, it will be canted up.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/21/2006 at 12:31
valleypine View Drop Down
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Originally posted by aimpoint aimpoint wrote:

The hole is not in the same place, so if you get the mount attached, it will be canted up.

 

Aimpoint,

 

I'll go on the AR-15.com website sometime and pose the question there. If someone there can't answer it, I doubt if anyone can. However, if you ever happen to come up with an answer I'd appreciate it if you could post it here and I'll do likewise if I find an answer. In any case, thanks for looking into this matter.

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