The Optics Talk Forums : Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 http://www.opticstalk.com/ This is an XML content feed of; The Optics Talk Forums : Rifle Scopes : Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 Thu, 09 Sep 2010 16:41:27 +0000 Sun, 15 Nov 2009 20:42:07 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 9.69 360 www.opticstalk.com/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=20120 The Optics Talk Forums http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_images/OPTICSTALK_Logo.png http://www.opticstalk.com/ Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Originally posted by mikeintxThe... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=255554#255554 Author: 1911man
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/15/2009 at 20:42

Originally posted by mikeintx

The place we do business with doesn't really have a LE discount per say that they advertise on anything but their LE guns. Their website doesn't have the Leupold you listed.  The do have the following:
 
Burris 2.5-10x50mm Euro Diamond Riflescope, 1/4 MOA, 3P #4 E-Dot Illuminated Reticle
        3-12x56mm Euro Diamond Riflescope, 1/4 MOA, 3P #4 E-Dot Illuminated Reticle
          3-9x40mm Burris Fullfield II LRS Riflescope, Illuminated Ballistic Plex Reticle
        3.5-10x50mm Burris Fullfield TAC30 Tactical Riflescope, Illuminated Ballistic Plex Reticle
          3.5-10x50mm Burris Fullfield 30 European Riflescope, Illum Ballistic Plex Reticle
        3-9x40mm Burris Fullfield TAC30 Tactical Riflescope, Illuminated Ballistic Plex Reticle
Bushnell 2.5-10x50mm Elite 4200 Riflescope, 1/4 MOA, Illuminated Reticle
Weaver 2.5-10x50mm Weaver Classic Extreme Riflescope, Illuminated Dual-X Reticle
 
Would you pick any of those?
 
If the Weaver Classic Extreme is still available, PM me a price, would love to have another one of these??? Awesome scope for hog hunting.
 
]]> Sun, 15 Nov 2009 20:42:07 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=255554#255554 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : for my 6.5 grendel AR I'm... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=255377#255377 Author: cruft
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/15/2009 at 06:20

for my 6.5 grendel AR I'm using a burris euro-diamond 1.5-6 with illumination.  for hunting magnification is way over rated.  you need field of view & easy target acquisation.  a deer or hog or coyote does not require benchrest capabilities.]]> Sun, 15 Nov 2009 06:20:26 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=255377#255377 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : please post up a report on that... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252662#252662 Author: ccoker
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/03/2009 at 19:54

please post up a report on that laser designator
I am VERY interested in one


]]> Tue, 03 Nov 2009 19:54:22 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252662#252662 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Thanks RD. I appreciate all the... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252646#252646 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/03/2009 at 19:21

Thanks RD. I appreciate all the advice from you guys. Chris really helped with all of his advice and putting hands on the different optics really made a big difference. Being able to see them and handle them gives one a total different perspective then just reading about them on here. I think ones own eyesight definetely has an effect on how one will view a specific scopes clarity. I looked through a Nikon ProStaff at another store that my department deals with and then looked through the Monarch 2.5-10x50 at SWFA. Man there is a huge difference. I was looking at the 4200 and the Monarch in 2.5-10x50 but I chose the Monarch ulitimately because of the fact that it had the BDC and was 60 bucks cheaper. The 4200 does have the rain coating stuff though but I don't plain on trapsing through the rain (at least on purpose anyway).

]]> Tue, 03 Nov 2009 19:21:05 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252646#252646 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : That combination should work just... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252586#252586 Author: RifleDude
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/03/2009 at 16:54

That combination should work just fine.  The ND-3 will compensate for the lack of illumination when night hunting.
 
Enjoy!
]]> Tue, 03 Nov 2009 16:54:50 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252586#252586 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Whoops type-o should be 2.5 not... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252575#252575 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/03/2009 at 16:37

Whoops type-o should be 2.5 not 2.4]]> Tue, 03 Nov 2009 16:37:12 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252575#252575 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Got my scope and laser designator... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252573#252573 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/03/2009 at 16:35

Got my scope and laser designator today at SWFA. Chris was great let me look through some optics and helped me narrow down the choices. Thx to Chris and SWFA! Definetely made a new future customer today!

Here's my choices:
Nikon Monarch 2.4-10x50 w/BDC reticle
Laser Genetics ND3
SWFA SSA high mounts w/extra top w/rail to mount LD

Pics will follow!]]> Tue, 03 Nov 2009 16:35:44 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252573#252573 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Originally posted by Rancid... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252461#252461 Author: RifleDude
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/03/2009 at 08:26

Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid

I have a 2.5-10 Trijicon and am very, very happuy with it: 2.5 on the low end for relative closups, 10X on the high end, for putting it in the ear or eye socket.
 
That is a nice scope, and I would own one if it weren't for the fact it has a 56mm objective and a fairly wide variable eye relief span from low to high magnification.
]]> Tue, 03 Nov 2009 08:26:47 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252461#252461 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : yep, that's a GREAT scope,... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252378#252378 Author: ccoker
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 20:23

yep, that's a GREAT scope, just wish it were smaller/lighter


]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 20:23:02 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252378#252378 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : I have a 2.5-10 Trijicon and am... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252375#252375 Author: Rancid Coolaid
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 19:50

I have a 2.5-10 Trijicon and am very, very happuy with it: 2.5 on the low end for relative closups, 10X on the high end, for putting it in the ear or eye socket.]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 19:50:35 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252375#252375 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : yeah, I feel I could easily kill... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252365#252365 Author: ccoker
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 18:23

yeah, I feel I could easily kill deer and hogs out to 200 yards with the 1-4 in the daylight
now, I wouldn't take neck shots on a deer at 200 yards
at night with ill I feel very confident at 75 yards which is common for hunting hogs

I do like more magnification and like to be able to deliver very tight groups, but I also like a low power and wide field of view for out walking around, and love an aimpoint/eotech or a true 1x scope

the 6.8 has drove me nuts because I want it to be a stalking gun and a night time pig killer
the 1.5-6 scope is a good all around scope for the gun with an ill ret
wish there were more options, the Burris Eurodiamond I had was pretty good but the il ret crapped out on me twice...

S&B flashdot 1.5-6 would be awesome :)

I wish there were more 2-7 ill ret scopes
]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 18:23:03 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252365#252365 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : I mostly agree.6X is good for... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252291#252291 Author: Rancid Coolaid
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 13:34

I mostly agree.

6X is good for most things, and is serviceable out to 300 yards.  The rifle is probably a 1MOA gun (maybe a little better) so it isn't going to be printing 1" groups at 300 yards - expectation is everything.

Ted knows Burris better than me, and he's killed a hog or 2 in his time.
]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 13:34:33 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252291#252291 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Originally posted by mikeintxRD,... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252288#252288 Author: RifleDude
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 13:27

Originally posted by mikeintx

RD,
 The only concern I have about the 1.5-6 is it going to be enought to shoot out to 200 or 300 yds? 
 
For informal target shooting, absolutely.  It's not a benchrest scope, obviously, but it's a good match for an AR.  Given the type of shooting you do with an AR, I wouldn't want to sacrifice FOV on the low end for a few extra Xs on the high end.
]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 13:27:48 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252288#252288 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : RD, That is a nice scope. I... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252276#252276 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 12:06

RD,
    That is a nice scope. I have never used a Burris or Bushnell. I have heard good things about both. The only concern I have about the 1.5-6 is it going to be enought to shoot out to 200 or 300 yds?  I know I can shoot at 100 all day long with it at 6.
]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 12:06:29 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252276#252276 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Mike, Were I in your shoes, given... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252251#252251 Author: RifleDude
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 10:46

Mike,
Were I in your shoes, given the selection of scopes listed, I'd get the Burris Signature 1.5-6X40 Electro-Dot.
http://swfa.com/Burris-15-6x40-Signature-Select-Rifle-Scope-P3600.aspx
It is well within your budget, and with your discount, you will have enough left over to get the ND-3.  A buddy of mine has this scope along with the ND-3 on his AR, and it is a nice combination!  He has been slaughtering hogs at night with this rig pretty regularly!  The Electro-Dot reticle is nice and small and has good intensity adjustment so that it doesn't overpower your sight picture. 
]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 10:46:08 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252251#252251 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : My 6.8 started with a 1-4, but... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252233#252233 Author: Rancid Coolaid
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 09:45

My 6.8 started with a 1-4, but I moved to a 2.5-10 when I realized I could not, with a 4X, put a round precisely where I wanted it at ranges greater than 100 yards.  The problem was more the reticle I had than the zoom range, probably, but I enjoy the 10X for precision placement.]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 09:45:59 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252233#252233 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : 1911man (Bill Wilson/Wilson Combat)... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252217#252217 Author: ccoker
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/02/2009 at 09:09

1911man (Bill Wilson/Wilson Combat) has been using the Burris FF2 Euro 3-10x50 ill on his 6.8 and has reported good stuff
I hear they give a good LE discount

have you contacted Trijicon directly to see about a LE discount?

I run the 1-4 on my 6.8 and I like it a lot as I mainly use it for hog hunting and it's closer range and I use some illumniation at night


]]> Mon, 02 Nov 2009 09:09:24 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252217#252217 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : PM sent...thanks for all the advice... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252125#252125 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 19:30

PM sent...thanks for all the advice RC!]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 19:30:48 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252125#252125 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : I do not have one of those, my... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252112#252112 Author: Rancid Coolaid
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 19:07

I do not have one of those, my military days are in the past, I am a civilian, no military discount for me  - so I don't buy Leupold.
But, were I in the need for a scope in the $700 range to do what Mike asks, that scope - if I could get it for $700 or so, would be on my list.

The 3-9SS beats it in every respect - except that the Leupold is illuminated and the SS is not.

Burris makes a decent scope, and the 6.8 doesn't need much eye relief - and having too much can be a pain.

Of that list, I'd do the 4200 or the Burris, whichever you like most.
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 19:07:40 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252112#252112 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Rancid Coolaidso, you have one... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252108#252108 Author: ccoker
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 19:01

Rancid Coolaid
so, you have one of those?
that is VERY interesting

I really dig my 6.8 btw

]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 19:01:55 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252108#252108 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : The place we do business with... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252046#252046 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 14:27

The place we do business with doesn't really have a LE discount per say that they advertise on anything but their LE guns. Their website doesn't have the Leupold you listed.  The do have the following:
 
Burris 2.5-10x50mm Euro Diamond Riflescope, 1/4 MOA, 3P #4 E-Dot Illuminated Reticle
        3-12x56mm Euro Diamond Riflescope, 1/4 MOA, 3P #4 E-Dot Illuminated Reticle
          3-9x40mm Burris Fullfield II LRS Riflescope, Illuminated Ballistic Plex Reticle
        3.5-10x50mm Burris Fullfield TAC30 Tactical Riflescope, Illuminated Ballistic Plex Reticle
          3.5-10x50mm Burris Fullfield 30 European Riflescope, Illum Ballistic Plex Reticle
        3-9x40mm Burris Fullfield TAC30 Tactical Riflescope, Illuminated Ballistic Plex Reticle
Bushnell 2.5-10x50mm Elite 4200 Riflescope, 1/4 MOA, Illuminated Reticle
Weaver 2.5-10x50mm Weaver Classic Extreme Riflescope, Illuminated Dual-X Reticle
 
Would you pick any of those?
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 14:27:54 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252046#252046 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : I've said it before: Leupold... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252029#252029 Author: Rancid Coolaid
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 13:53

I've said it before: Leupold is a well-priced scope, so long as you get military or LE discount.  If you can buy at LE discount prices, look at Leupold.

Bushnell 6500 is also a good scope, with a great zoom range.  Zeiss Conquest also makes a great scope.

I would avoid Millett, I hear they are having some issues.  And I have little experience with Nikon or Weaver, have owned both, but not the models you would be considering.

Were I in your shoes, I'd be looking at this - with LE discount, it'll be right around your max spend.

http://swfa.com/Leupold-25-8x36-Mark-4-MRT-30mm-Riflescope-P5936.aspx


]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 13:53:55 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252029#252029 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : I did some checking andthe place... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252026#252026 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 13:41

I did some checking and the place that I have the ability to buy from through my department does not have Trijicons.
 
So if I have to buy from any other store then my budget is like 300.
 
So the place that I can get scopes through my department has the following higher end brands:
Leupold
Burris
Bushnell
Zeiss
Weaver
Millett
Nikon
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 13:41:09 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252026#252026 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : The draw of the Trijicon (in addition... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252021#252021 Author: Rancid Coolaid
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 13:18

The draw of the Trijicon (in addition the glass, it is very good glass for the price) is the self-illuminated reticle.

As you've noticed, your EoTech is nothing but a paper weight until you turn it on (and assuming the battery isn't dead.)  The beauty of a Trijicon is that it is always one (at least for the first 11 years or so) and nothing needs to be done to be ready to shoot.  I like this for a hog gun, because encounters can be quick and require precision and speed, and the Trijicon does both.


Also, the 6.8 kinda drops off fast at 300 yards, so if you go with a BDC-type reticle, be sure to spend some time on the range to determine what ranges correspond with the drop points.


Good luck!
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 13:18:43 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252021#252021 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : I like the Trijicons. Just can't... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252018#252018 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 12:58

I like the Trijicons. Just can't rap my head around their price tags. $680 bucks for a 3-9x40 that doesn't even have target turrets. Guess I am going to have to go and take a look at some and maybe that will give me a better idea of that I want with what I need.]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:58:23 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252018#252018 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Originally posted by mikeintxCorrect... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252017#252017 Author: RifleDude
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 12:46

Originally posted by mikeintx

Correct me if I am wrong, but I always thought that the bigger the Obj then the more light the scope gathered. Is that not true?  I ask that because I have been trying to find something in the 4-16x50 size. Thoughts?????


In general, yes, but it all depends on the magnification used as to whether or not a big objective does anything for you.  At low to moderate magnifications, a large objective does absolutely nothing for you except add weight and bulk to the rifle.  As long as your scope's exit pupil is at least in the 5 - 7mm range and the scope's optics transmit light well, you don't need a larger objective.  Until you get to 8X or greater, an objective larger than 40mm doesn't provide a noticeable difference.  So, if you get a 1-4X, the 24mm objective is providing all the useful light transmission the scope is capable of delivering.
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:46:38 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252017#252017 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Thanks guys! RC, I am already... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252013#252013 Author: mikeintx
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 12:32

Thanks guys!  RC, I am already stressed trying to figure out what scope I want. 
 
I forgot to mention that I used to have another AR back in the day that just had the ole 1-4x scope attached to the handle. It was a cheap version but none the less it worked and I never had any issues with it.
 
I am pretty sure that I will see more bench time than anything with the rifle. I am hoping to do some hunting but I don't get to do much. My other guns that I have I generally shoot somewhere in the 4-6 power at 100 yds and group nice sub 1" to .5" groups all day long. So that is my experience there. I do have another AR in 223 but it is my CQB rifle and it has an EOTech on it.
 
Correct me if I am wrong, but I always thought that the bigger the Obj then the more light the scope gathered. Is that not true?  I ask that because I have been trying to find something in the 4-16x50 size. Thoughts?????
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:32:46 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=252013#252013 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : If the rifle is zeroed at the... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=251996#251996 Author: RifleDude
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 11:51

If the rifle is zeroed at the range you're shooting, it is as accurate as any reticle, and in fact allows more precise aiming than most, if you aim with the very end of the sharp point of the triangle as you should.  It is certainly no less precise than a typical plex reticle.

For hunting, it is no worse than a typical plex for holdover, since the post is "clear" in the middle.  It certainly isn't as good as a multi-point reticle for longer range shooting.]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 11:51:42 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=251996#251996 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : Rifledude and RC: How "accurate"... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=251986#251986 Author: cheaptrick
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 11:12

Rifledude and RC:
How "accurate" is the Trijicon lit post reticle for paper targets out to 300 yards?
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 11:12:47 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=251986#251986 Scope advice need for 6.8 AR15 : I've done a fair bit of hog... http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=251983#251983 Author: Rancid Coolaid
Subject: 20120
Posted: November/01/2009 at 11:05

I've done a fair bit of hog hunting and recently gone to a 6.8 AR for the task, here are a few thoughts.

1.  Shoot as many different rounds as possible with your rifle.  My 6.8 is more particular than many guns I've owned/shot; it likes the lighter faster stuff more than the heavier slower stuff (which is the opposite of what I want it to be, but such is life.)

2.  For hog hunting, you really, REALLY want an illuminated reticle.  Hogs like the cover of darkness, be prepared.  My 6.8 wears a 2.5-10 Trijicon with post reticle.  The mil dot will give you good, quick range adjustments, but only the center dot is illuminated.

3.  For hogs, you really need to take a look at this thing:
http://swfa.com/Laser-Genetics-ND-3-Laser-Designator-P41090.aspx

It is a laser designator, or, maybe better described as a laser flashlight.  It projects a circle of light on the target up to 250 yards away, and it is a well defined circle, no bleed over on the edges, just green illumination on a defined target area.  It is better than night vision (except the expensive stuff, that is.)  For a hog gun, it is money well spent.


Lastly, be advised, hanging out on Optics Talk can stress your bank account and your marriage: there is much here to learn and there are many, many good products to buy.  Don't say we didn't warn you!
]]> Sun, 01 Nov 2009 11:05:48 +0000 http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20120&PID=251983#251983