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5mil poi shift..gen 2 razor on ar10

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ballshrinker View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 5mil poi shift..gen 2 razor on ar10
    Posted: January/01/2017 at 09:34
It's mounted with the American defense recon. I put a new stock on it since it was last sighted in and since killing two deer with it. Pretty sure I had new stock on when I killed last one so I'm not sure how I got lucky and pulled down 5 mil and still connected....

This scope has been frustrating. The first time I couldn't get sighted in...come to find out scope was moving. I had it tightened to lowest recommended torque. I increased to highest recommended torque and put the taboo dab of loctite on ring bolts.

Each deer shot had weird experiences but I won't go into it here but that led me to check zero again....off high by 5mil. The aggravating zero stop wouldn't let me adjust so I just used reticle to find delta...100yds btw.

Any ideas? New stock? Parallax? Weak mount for such heavy scope?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/01/2017 at 15:17
I tend to use LaRue, Talley, Badger Ordnance, and Warne. Recently picked up an SS mount all of these have been reliable. I have had some good and bad experience with Leupold and Burris mounts and Armalite.   I have friends who swear by BOBRO and AADLAND mounts both of which are considered very good choices.  Generally speaking the mount is the most suspect part of a system.
I think either of these would be a good choice or a La Rue LT107 if the scope is 34mm tube. 
http://swfa.com/mounts-rings-and-bases/bobro-dual-lever-precision-optic-34mm-mount-1.html

http://swfa.com/mounts-rings-and-bases/aadland-ar-34mm-scope-mount.html
If it's 30 mm tube that opens up a lot more options but I still like AADLAND if you dont need quick detach and BOBRO or LaRue if you want quick detach. I will note that Badger Ordanace ultra high rings are too heavy for words so not recommended due to weight of the steel rings the alloy ones ok.

Obviously something is off because 5 mil is a lot.  Any chance the knobs could have been bumped and be off due to that ?  You just have to systematically check the scope, the mount, the rifle.  I know its a huge pain but eventually you will figure out what works.  I picked up this package deal with a SS mount and a 2-7 redfield for one rifle and for the price you cant beat it for a way to test the rifle.
http://swfa.com/optics/browse/riflescopes/redfield-2-7x33-revolution-rifle-scope-kit.html


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - January/01/2017 at 15:27

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/01/2017 at 18:20
Thanks for the reply. Would lapping rings b worthwhile? I think it's just too heavy for the mount.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whitefire Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/01/2017 at 21:03
If you have the equipment to test the alignment of the scope by all means please do especially if you use a two piece base. In the process you will find the answer to your lapping question. I have never had to lap Warne or Talley, others slightly to moderate.

Whether it would make a difference in scope performance I don't know,   when you really torque scope rings down you just don't know what happens to the internal moving parts of a rifle scope. Perhaps I'm being redundant however, much less torque is needed than many in the shooting populous assume.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/01/2017 at 21:49
American defense recon is a one piece mount. I would not lap it. If u are already having slipping pronlems lapping will just make them even bigger and out of round as it always takes more off the bottom than the top simply because of gravity.

Its unlikely they would be out of alignment. But anything is possible. I am pretty sure lapping would void the warranty. If u think it is a mount problem i would call AD. I bet they would work with you to give you assistance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 12:13
I think it's this pin that keeps falling out. It's gone now. Some kind of cross alignment pin at bottom of rings.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rancid Coolaid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 13:08
Maybe I missed it, but which gen2 razor is on the rifle?

And I have several AD Recon mounts, just took one off a gun and looked, I don't see the pin you are talking about.

Finally, if a piece fell off your mount, I would discontinue use of the mount.  Mechanical devices of a good design usually do not have superfluous parts; if something is gone, that would indicate some manner of loss of function.

I have several AD mounts and several gen2 razors, something sounds very wrong, and I am guessing it has something to do with the mount and your missing piece.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 14:15
4.5-27 56". I have a pic of it but that's a pain to upload. It's dead center below the rings running through the mount.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 14:45
American Defense AD-RECON Scope MountIs it this mount?   I would probably call the manufacturer.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 14:48

Aadland AR 34mm Scope Mount

Matte, Steel, 20 MOA, Bubble Level, Generation III Stock# AADMOUNT34GIII
Aadland AR 34mm Scope Mount

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 15:06
Can't get into photobucket...yeah it's that one but u can see the pin on the other side not shown in photo.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whitefire Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 15:48
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

American defense recon is a one piece mount. I would not lap it. If u are already having slipping pronlems lapping will just make them even bigger and out of round as it always takes more off the bottom than the top simply because of gravity.

Its unlikely they would be out of alignment. But anything is possible. I am pretty sure lapping would void the warranty. If u think it is a mount problem i would call AD. I bet they would work with you to give you assistance.


I agree, I'm not an advocate, lap only if you must. However, I test every time I mount for reasons stated above. In many years I've never had an issue lapping the rings, gravitation shouldn't a problem if turned judiciously.

As ST73 states its best to use a one piece mount.

Also torque is your friend only to a point, then, after the sweet spot it becomes an enemy of both you and the scope.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rancid Coolaid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 16:54
If I need to lap rings, there is a problem that I would rather not get wrong. I don't lap rings, I make sure everything is done right before it comes to that.

Edited by Rancid Coolaid - January/03/2017 at 08:46
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 16:56
Is it the pin between the two bolts on the bottom of the ring?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 18:37
Yeah
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 19:25
I honestly think that is just there to help line the ring halves up to make it simpler to put them together. I dont see how rhat would cause the rings to slip.

I would still call AD and just see what they think.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 19:41
They said they would look at it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 19:51
Not that that makes me feel that much better. I will probably just get a different mount. It's not like I'm in combat but I can't stand wounding an animal that did nothing to deserve it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2017 at 20:17
When it comes to mounts the less moving parts and less places it has to fail the better.  AAdland looks to me like a solid choice.    I kind of wonder if they sent you a 35 mm instead of a 34 mm.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/03/2017 at 00:00
5 mrad shift at 100 yards is huge.

I have had very good luck with ADM products, but anything is possible.  Just to be clear: the POI shifts around randomly? or did it shift 5mrad and stay there?

Either way, have ADM look at the mount.  If you decide to switch and do not need QD functionality, I can not recommend Aadmount enough.  I've used a bunch of them and they are absolutely superb.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/04/2017 at 17:31
I don't know if it's still moving. The shot placement on the deer were suspect. I really just shot it enough to find out how bad it was out of position and quit since I didn't have tools for zero stop.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/05/2017 at 01:22
Have you checked this at the range since?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/05/2017 at 18:13
No that was Monday and adm said the pin would do that. I sent it to them today. Not real happy but don't want to spend 200+ on a new one. I requested a new one. I hope they don't just sick a pin in it and send it back.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ballshrinker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/05/2017 at 18:15
Oh and they implied it was my fault if I didn't torque the bottom halves down first. I followed instructions but couldn't remember that. Something yall may want to know.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rancid Coolaid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/05/2017 at 18:49
Do you read directions?
Did you read the directions?
That is one difference between most rings and their mount.
I actually like that about it.
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