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40mm vs 50mm objective

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/19/2012 at 22:07
mil169 View Drop Down
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I've thought about this for awhile know and even purchased a scope in the meantime (which I decided wasn't the right one), but I'm still looking for a scope for the 7 mag.

I've chosen to go with a Leopold vx3 3.5-10 with the cds. I know how people feel about the limitations of the cds system, but once I figure out a rifle,scope, and load combination it will stay together. I don't constantly move scopes around. The only draw back to me with shooting out to 400 or so yards is not having a hold for wind age, but that will be at the range and not hunting.

With that being said- what are the pros/cons of the 40mm and 50mm objective lens system?

As always, thanks for the info.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/19/2012 at 23:42
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Probably best to read through this and ask questions if there is something(s) you don't understand.
 
 
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/20/2012 at 08:40
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with a a good quality scope like the vx3 40mm is fine 50mm is better. Cheap scope 50 will be much noticed in brightness.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/20/2012 at 10:08
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Thanks for the links, I'll have to try to digest the info.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2012 at 12:59
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Looking at yet another scope. Urmaginary Friend suggested a bushnell elite 6500 2.5-16x42 awhile back, which I like. But I don't like the DOA reticle, anyone have subtensions details for the fine multi-x? Would like to know before I pull the trigger on one.
 
Thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2012 at 15:55
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Don't know if Bushnell lists subtension values but you could try their CS. That's the scope I'm going with too, only the Mil Dot version.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2012 at 18:03
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Contacted Bushnell's CS today, took 1/2 an hour but oh well, everyone's busy. Anyway, the rep I spoke with couldn't get the stadia dimension for the 6500 multi-x, said he had to contact the engineering department and get back with me. Hopefully I get an email sometime tomorrow. I let you know what I find out. Unless someone that has one already reads this and can let me know sooner, I'm worried about it being to thin and not being able to see it during low light. In Nebraska we can hunt deer 1/2 hr before/after sunset.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2012 at 18:37
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That was actually my concern as well. the low light issue. Couple of folks have stated that the mil dot reticle is slightly bolder than the fine duplex so I'm going that route.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2012 at 20:24
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I"ll try to get that dimension as well. I know that in these "precision" scopes that at long range they don't want the stadia to cover up the target completely, but in hunting situations it would be nicer to have a thicker stadia. That was my only complaint on the vortex viper hs with the dead hold bdc. Hopefully the Bushnell is closer to a VX3 or SII duplex, I know what those look like.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2012 at 22:32
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I think some of the brain trusts at these scope companies need to get back to basics and at least offer a good visible reticle for hunters. Most of these rangefinding reticles with yardage and wind hold off points suck anyway. I think it's all about change and "new and improved" type reticles that will attract Black Ops video gamers who probably don't even hunt anyway.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2012 at 17:24
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I agree, the last time I spoke with Ken at Vortex I told him my 2 cents. The HS means Hunter Series, which would mean to me not a target scope, which to me means heavier reticle or at least make it illuminated. I hate to say it, but outside the Leupold and Sightron duplex, there nothing right know that I am comfortable with. My son's VX2 duplex is easier to see at night than my my last Vortex expirement.
 
Anyway, a couple of other things. Can anyone tell me the formula to figure the stadia dimension change with the variable power? I had it once, and can't find it. Lastly, I shouldn't be surpised, but I didn't get an email from Bushnell. I really like the 30mm tube, but with out being sure I'm going to like the reticle, for the me the VX3 3.5-10x40 CDS is still the front runner.
 
I guess as far as that goes, does anyone know if the duplex in the VX3 is the same as the duplex used in the VX3 CDS, and what those stadia dimensions are?
 
Thanks


Edited by mil169 - May/22/2012 at 17:52
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2012 at 20:26
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Option #3:  While the 3.5-10 is one of my favorite Leupolds, if you specifically want accurate/reliable tracking and a good reticle, get the 3-9 SS with the Mil-Quad instead.

The Mil-Quad in the 3-9 is more visible than the Leupold duplex in low light by a long way.  Yes, even when on 3X.  And you can use your wind holds at any power without worry.  You can get the elevation knob done with yards by Kenton (which I do feel is nice for hunting out to moderate ranges).  This makes for an excellent all around setup for a hunting rifle that's hard to beat for the price.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2012 at 22:01
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I guess I really would like to see a 3-9x42ss, anyone that has one live near N.E Nebraska?  The only thing that would concern me, would be the the open turrets. How stiff are they to turn, can they be moved accidentally?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2012 at 22:07
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40 mm objectives allow lower mounting of the scope and this allows for somewhat better handling and a lower center of gravity. A 40 mm objective lens divided by 7 (exit pupil) makes for 5.7 magification; the iris of the human eyeball will open up to approx 7mm except in older folks. A 50 mm objective divided by 7 (exit pupil) makes for 7.1 magnification. How much more can you see with 40 mm scope set at 5.7 magnification vs. a 50 mm set at 7.1 power? A wider exit pupil make for less critical eye positioning but parallax issues might occur.
I never felt handicapped by 40 mm objective lens scopes set at 12, 14, and up to 20 power. I do much of my shooting at pre dawn and dusk with little 40 mm objective lens scopes that are reasonably high quality (good lens coatings) and high resolution - Zeiss 3-9, Leupold 12X FXIII, Leupold M4 4.5-14, Weaver GS 3.5-10, 4.5-14, 6.5-20 and I do very well. The 20 X scope is usually set at 14-16 X in dim light.
 
As far as range estimating reticles on variable power 2nd focal plane scopes I rather not. I just shot right over a coyote at 400 yds with my 6-20 X GS when it was set on 10 X. Those stadia points grow apart as magnification is decreased.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2012 at 04:06
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Originally posted by mil169 mil169 wrote:

I guess I really would like to see a 3-9x42ss, anyone that has one live near N.E Nebraska? 

Yes, seeing a scope in person is always good if you can.  Pictures don't do justice to the SS reticle.
Quote The only thing that would concern me, would be the the open turrets. How stiff are they to turn, can they be moved accidentally?

They're quite firm and the knobs aren't "grabby," so there's a very low chance they'll move accidentally (they never have on me).  The Leupold CDS is much easier to turn and more likely to do so accidentally.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2012 at 13:00
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Well, with help from Koshkin and Scott from vortex I got the stadia dimensions I was after so far.  At least I know how to manipulate the stated dimensions for my comparison purposes. Still no word from the engineers at Bushnell.
 
I know that at 9x on a SII the stadia is .22 and at 3x it is .66. on a Leupold standard duplex the stadia is listed as .25 on 10x and .7 on 3.5x, so these two duplex's are very similiar. So, if I can get the dimensions for the Bushnell mulit-x I should be able to tell wether or not I'm going to like it.
 
As a side note- Koshkin figured it out on his own (not sure how he did it, but not a surprise) but sent me a table listing all of the dimenisons for the two listed variable power scopes. Thanks again for help.
 
From Scott at Vortex: "If you are referring to what the subtensions on milling/BDC type reticles change to on different mags, all you have to do is Divide the mag your on into the mag that the reticle is calibrated to and take that number and multiply it by the subtensions in the reticle."
 
That was exactly what I was looking for. Thanks guys for the help. Goes to partially show the wealth of knowledge linked to this forum.


Edited by mil169 - May/24/2012 at 14:43
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2012 at 20:04
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Split the difference try 44 mm
SPL16161 Zeiss 4.5-14x44 Conquest Rifle Scope DEMO-B
Click to view 5214309972, Matte, Rapid Z 800, 1"
$649.95
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2012 at 21:11
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Originally posted by Urimaginaryfrnd Urimaginaryfrnd wrote:

Split the difference try 44 mm
SPL16161 Zeiss 4.5-14x44 Conquest Rifle Scope DEMO-B
Click to view 5214309972, Matte, Rapid Z 800, 1"
$649.95
Anyone know which load out of a 7 rem mag would match this reticle?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2012 at 21:33
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Originally posted by mil169 mil169 wrote:

Originally posted by Urimaginaryfrnd Urimaginaryfrnd wrote:

Split the difference try 44 mm
SPL16161 Zeiss 4.5-14x44 Conquest Rifle Scope DEMO-B
Click to view 5214309972, Matte, Rapid Z 800, 1"
$649.95
Anyone know which load out of a 7 rem mag would match this reticle?
 
Never mind- found a article with a link to the calculator. Looks like with my Hornady SST Superformance 154 grain ammo, the subtensions will work out well out to 800 yds on 12x.
 
I think I may have finally found my scope.
 
This thing is easy to see at LOWLIGHT ....... right........Big Smile
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2012 at 22:03
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The Rapid Z reticles are really nice and stand out well in low light.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2012 at 22:46
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Sounds great, I picked one of the 24 available up. Now's there's only 23.
 
Found out from SWFA that even on the factory refurbished stuff from Ziess that it will still have the Lifetime Transferable warranty. Can't beat that.


Edited by mil169 - May/25/2012 at 11:22
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/30/2012 at 20:35
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The 7 mag is done. Scope came in today and is mounted up. Looks great, love the reticle. All that's left know is to shoot.
 
Hope to get out to the range on Saturday and see how it shoots. I'm going to try a break in procedure, we'll see how much patience I have.
 
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