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280 Rem & 25-06 -- 1st Reloads

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/29/2012 at 15:34
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I got out to try my first reloads this morning, with mixed results.  Everything was shot off a weighted-down Lead Sled...both rifles were recently cleaned with fouling rounds run through them.

The 280 shot everything pretty well.  My best 5-shot group was 0.674'' (140 gr. Barnes TSX-Bt / 51 gr. IMR 4350)...the worst was 1.428'' (Barnes / 51.5 gr. IMR 4350).  
My best group with the 150 gr. GameKings was 0.765'' (48.5 gr. IMR 4350).  Overall I'm happy with the results, so I probably won't play with the loads too much.   

The 25-06 was a different story.  I loaded up 20 rounds of 117 gr. Sierra GameKings with powder loads (IMR 4350) of 47, 48, 49, & 50 gr., all seated the same depth.  My best 5 shot group was 1.775''...the worst was 2.688''.  I don't know if I should try a different bullet or a faster burning powder.

I attached some target pictures...any input or advice is welcome.

280 Rem:

(The first pic I omitted the flyer for the group size...not sure what happened.)













I'll only post 1 picture of the 25-06.  This was the middle group size wise of the 3-groups:








Edited by M7025-06 - January/29/2012 at 18:40
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/29/2012 at 16:23
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You might want to try a slower powder, R22 or 4831 and see what happens.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/29/2012 at 17:31
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 +1 
 
  My son's .25-06 using 115gr Partitions does best with RL22.  IMR4831 wasn't bad either.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/29/2012 at 20:31
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Thanks for the info guys.

Would trying a lighter bullet, say around 100 gr., work better with the 4350, or should I still go with a slower burning powder?


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 02:30
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Most .25-06 rifles have a 1-10 twist and yours probably does also.
 
I think 117 bullets might be just on the stability edge for your rifle. Thinking back on shooting with my 1-10 twist .25-06 I never really got super results with 120 flat base or 117 boat tail bullets.
 
My very best group with the .25-06 measured about .4 with the 100 gr. Sierra flat base and H4831 powder.
 
My humble suggestions would be to try the 100 gr Nosler BT (varmints) with H4350, R19, or H4831. If those work extend your efforts to include the 100 gr Barnes tipped triple shock for hunting.
 
Your efforts with the .280 are worthy both from accuracy and record keeping.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 07:54
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Originally posted by Stevey Ducks Stevey Ducks wrote:

Most .25-06 rifles have a 1-10 twist and yours probably does also.
 
I think 117 bullets might be just on the stability edge for your rifle. Thinking back on shooting with my 1-10 twist .25-06 I never really got super results with 120 flat base or 117 boat tail bullets.
 
My very best group with the .25-06 measured about .4 with the 100 gr. Sierra flat base and H4831 powder.
 
My humble suggestions would be to try the 100 gr Nosler BT (varmints) with H4350, R19, or H4831. If those work extend your efforts to include the 100 gr Barnes tipped triple shock for hunting.
 
Your efforts with the .280 are worthy both from accuracy and record keeping.

Thanks Stevey.

Yep...it's a 10 twist with a 24'' barrel. 

 I've got 1/2 a box of 100 gr sierra gamekings on the shelf...I'll load up a few with the IMR 4350 and another powder (probably 4831) and see what happens.
  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 08:43
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Even Berger's 115 VLD says it will stabilize with a 10T.
Sometimes, a barrel's twist may be off of a .25 on one side or another-One possibility.
My first guess, as others have said it try a different bullet, even if stability is not the issue.
On an old 338WM many moons ago I had my mind made up using a 210 Partition.  It shot terrible.
I tried everything (seat depth, primer change, powder change)-Still shot terrible.
The trigger had been lightened already, had a steady rest, stock bedded and free-floated all beforehand (average shooter though).
This was early in my loading days, so I was so frustrated, I was considering having a custom tube put on, and the gunsmith suggested trying a different bullet.  Bought a box of 250 grain Partitions and the majority of the time it stayed under an inch.  My barrel just hated those 210 Partitions.
Hope you find the diet it likes.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 10:54
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  I load slightly lighter bullets (100 and 110 grain pills) for my .25-06 with good results from both 4350 and 4831 if I am shooting mid-range velocity or higher velocity loads.  With the heavier bullets my .25-06 only likes lighter to mid-range velocity loads.  In my .25-06, when I drive bullets weighing over 110 grains at higher velocities than I shoot in my .257 Roberts, groups are OK but not great.
 
  I did find a load using RL19 that shot tiny groups with heavier bullets on 80 degree days, but when the temperature would drop it would behave differently.
 
  Who needs at 120 grain .25-06 load when you are doing so well with that .280!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 11:29
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lighter bullet, slower powder should be the trick.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 12:08
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  Light bullet - faster powder, heavy bullet - slower powder.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 12:29
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Picked a jug of R-22 and loaded up some 100 gr. Sierra G.K.'s and 100 gr. Barnes TSX's.  I didn't load near as many as last time just to see if they have any potential.  Hopefully I can sneak out in a day or so and give 'em a run.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 13:13
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Originally posted by 3 Tuns 3 Tuns wrote:

  Light bullet - faster powder, heavy bullet - slower powder.

quite the opposite in bigger calibers.

if it were my 25-06 i would be trying a 110gr accubond with some imr 7828 or retumbo or h-1000. the more overbore you go the slower the powder i would use imo.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 13:20
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I'd also load up some of the 117gr seirras with R22.  Trial an error is the key.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 15:38
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  The go to powder for the 100 gr bullet (old Nosler Solid Base) in my son's rifle was IMR4831.  IMR4350 gives the best accuracy at the highest velocity w/100gr bullets in the Nosler #4 manual so if RL22 doesn't work for you might give it a try since you already have some. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 15:45
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I would start with H-4831SC or H-4350 myself
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 18:56
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I loaded up some 100 gr GameKings with IMR 4350, 100 gr Barnes TSX's with R22, & 117 gr. GameKings with R22 (along with a few 140 gr Barnes' on top of some R22 just to see what they'd do in the 280).  

I can't seem to find any load data for the 100 gr. Barnes' using IMR 4350, so if anybody has a recipe they'd like to share...let me know.

 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/30/2012 at 20:50
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Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

Originally posted by 3 Tuns 3 Tuns wrote:

  Light bullet - faster powder, heavy bullet - slower powder.

quite the opposite in bigger calibers.
 
  In much bigger calibers (not overbore situation) fast powders work well for heavy bullets.  My .375 rifles like RL15 with 270 and 300 grain bullets, so does my .416 RM with 400 grain bullets.  For overbore cartridges like the .25-06 slightly slower powder (within reason) usually give the best results with heavy bullets (115 - 120 grains), and slightly faster powders usually work better for lighter bullets (100 grains and under).
 
  Of course, each rifle is a law unto itself.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/31/2012 at 08:21
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my .375 loves imr 4064. rl15 was so-so.


john haviland did an article in a mag a few years ago on the 25-06 the best group his rifle shot was .53" he used a 100gr sierra sbt (game king) with 55.5gr of rl22 seated to a col of 3.19" chronod at 3191fps. his next best group was .068 same sierra bullet 100gr gk 56gr 4831 same 3.19" col and it chronod at 3321. when he stepped up to a 120gr noslers he only had one group go under an inch. 55 gr of h-1000 chronod at 2911fps.
layne simpson did an article in a different mag and imr 4350 was the fastest powder he used (i think, im not sure where v-n160 falls in line for burn rate) any who he loaded most of his stuff from 75gr to 120 with rl19 h4831 rl22 and retumbo. he didnt not accuracy though. he did mention however that in the previous decades he has probably burned more h-4831 in the 25-06 than in any other chambering. ( that right there says a lot) he also goes on to say that he has been equally happy with rl-22 and retumbo in the 25-06.


so, i would recommend you try out some different bullets and powders. this is what reloading is all about, its the thrill of the hunt to finding that one load.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/31/2012 at 14:38
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Looks like R22 might be the ticket for the 25-06 (with 100 gr. Barnes TSX's).  A 4-shot group ended up at 1.172''...not great but it's a start.  Not sure why I didn't load up few 100 gr. Sierra's with the R22, but I'll try 'em next time.

Also found the R22 doesn't do too bad in my 280.  Had a 4-shot group of 0.619'' with a moderate powder load.  I might tinker with this combo and see what happens.


25-06 (sorry for the blurry pic...camera's smarter than the operator)



280 Rem


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/31/2012 at 14:46
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try some 140gr sierra's in your .280 i bet they will shoot really good too
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/31/2012 at 15:07
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Glad you are seeing some improvement.
The 110 Nosler AB would be one of my considerations, if you have some handy
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/31/2012 at 15:56
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Ernie & Pyro

I think I'm gonna make work with what I have right now.  I've spent waaay more than I planned in the last 2 weeks.  So much for reloading to save money Belt Fed  oh well...I'm hooked.  When I get the funds built back up a tad, I'll start tinkering around a little more.  I think I'm on the right path with the R22 for the 25-06.

Thanks again for all of the help.



Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/31/2012 at 16:08
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i will have to check my supplies, if i have some 140s laying around i would be happy to send them your way. i will get back to you on that tomorrow.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/01/2012 at 08:07
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This would be my go to round.  thats a nice nice group.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/01/2012 at 08:41
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Components are pricey.
Take your time and enjoy the process.
Over time I have built up stock of the type of bullets I use the most in what are my primary calibers: 6mm, 6.5, 7mm, and 338.  When I get a new barrel/gun, then I can try a variety to see what it likes.  Again, that took time and moneyBig Grin

Originally posted by M7025-06 M7025-06 wrote:

Ernie & Pyro

I think I'm gonna make work with what I have right now.  I've spent waaay more than I planned in the last 2 weeks.  So much for reloading to save money Belt Fed  oh well...I'm hooked.  When I get the funds built back up a tad, I'll start tinkering around a little more.  I think I'm on the right path with the R22 for the 25-06.

Thanks again for all of the help.



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