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25/06 or25/06ai

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/16/2014 at 20:26
257nut View Drop Down
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how much difference do you get from a 25/06 to a 25/06 Ackley.  is this a better Ackley cartridge than using a 243 Ackley.  for deer.
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  Welcome to OT, 257. IMO, 25/06 is too overbore already. Been there,...   257 Robts. AI was one of Ackley's favorites.    None will kill a deer any deader than the others.   I know I didn't answer your question. Not enough difference to call.  Do whichever appeals most to you. Bandito
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/22/2014 at 14:01
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Originally posted by 257nut 257nut wrote:

how much difference do you get from a 25/06 to a 25/06 Ackley.  is this a better Ackley cartridge than using a 243 Ackley.  for deer.


somewhere in the 100-200fps neighborhood. better is somewhat of a subjective term.. Imo, the .25-06 is a great deer caliber.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/22/2014 at 14:55
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do you reload?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 10:08
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yes I do .  I used to reload for the 25/06
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 10:20
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Heck then get the AI.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 10:53
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If the question is to AI or not to AI, I say yes, you should - but with disclaimers.
But, prior to that, I would ask what about a 243AI is inadequate for deer?  I have a 243AI and love it, very accurate, easy reloading, and the extra few grains of powder gets me a few hundred extra FPS.

I had a 25-06 many years ago, sold it, and regret letting it go to this very day.  It was a great rifle.  

If going to AI, be aware that many will complain of the fire forming process, it wastes barrel life.  Truth be told, I like my rifle as much firing factory 243 as I do firing custom loads, it is very accurate with both, and I cook pretty hot 243s to do the fire forming - and the gun doesn't seem to mind.

If the extra velocity isn't worth the effort, stick with factory SAAMI stuff and forget the AI route.  If you want the option to go fast or go really fast, AI is a great option.

Between 243 and 25-06, I'm not sure which I would take.  Both have killed lots of animals.  Given that the 243 is a SA and the 25-06 is a LA, I'd probably do the 243, if only for the little benefits SA has over non-magnum LA.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 16:30
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Keep in mind the few extra FPS of velocity isn't the only reason to AI. AI'ing a chamber also makes your brass last longer because the straighter taper on the side of the case grips the chamber better when under firing pressure, and therefore, the brass stretches less longitudinally. That fact alone makes it worth doing to me. Any extra velocity gain, however slight, is just a bonus.

If having an AI chamber involved a bunch of hassles, then I would agree it wouldn't be worth doing in exchange for the very modest velocity gains. But, as RC said, part of the goal of the AI chamber is to allow you to also use factory ammo with total safety, since factory ammo still headspaces off the shoulder- neck intersection. And in many cases, you still get very good accuracy from factory ammo in an AI chamber, so your fire-forming shots aren't wasted. I call that "win-win."

If you're going to be reloading anyway, it makes no difference except for the AI dies cost a little more.

I wouldn't bother AI'ing an inexpensive factory rifle that you don't shoot a whole lot and that shoots well already. However, if you're planning to rebarrel, it doesn't cost any more to chamber for AI vs. the standard SAAMI parent case, so why not AI? The only real disadvantage to going AI is the added cost of the reloading dies, but we're only talking about maybe $30 more.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 16:40
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By the way, as much as I like 25's for nostalgic reasons, I have to begrudgingly admit that it doesn't do anything 6mm's won't do. .257 is a very neglected, less common bore size, and as such, it suffers from pitiful bullet selection compared to just about every other caliber. For that fact alone, I think you'd be better off going with .243 AI. Believe it or not, with a high BC 100ish class bullet, the .243 catches up and surpasses the .25 at somewhere around 400 yds given current .257" bullet offerings. At closer range, no critter will know the difference between a 100 gr. .243" bullet and a 110 gr. bullet that's only 0.014" larger in diameter. What one will do, the other will do, as long as you select a bullet of appropriate construction for the job.


Edited by RifleDude - June/23/2014 at 17:00
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 16:58
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Yeah Ted but the Bob has soul! Big Grin
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 17:01
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Yeah, I know. After all, it's named "Bob," so it's almost like it can talk to you, and all!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 18:57
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Im a big fan of the 7m08 and .243.  I had a 25-06 for a while and it realy did not like the heavier bullets so a lot depends on the twist rate of the barrel make sure you are getting a twist rate that works for your intended use.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 18:58
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BULLET WEIGHT / CALIBER / TWIST RATE CHART

Grain/Cal.172.204.224.243.257.264.277.284.308.338.358
17-209-10
2510
30912
33 12
35 12
37 VLD6
40 12
50-52 914
55 12
60 12
68-69 9,1013,14
75 9 14
80 8
85 7121212
90 710
100 1010 1214
105-107 8
120 1010 1215,16
130 10 14
140 91010
150 14
140-160 8101012,13
150-168 911,12,13
150-180 10,11,12
160 9
175 9
180 10,11,12
200 10,1110,1212,16
220 10
225 10,1212,16
240-250 101012
300 1012
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/23/2014 at 19:00
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Originally posted by bugsNbows bugsNbows wrote:

Yeah Ted but the Bob has soul! Big Grin


My Bob definitely has soul!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/24/2014 at 07:27
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bowsNbugs

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So does mine Skip. It's a beauty (Cooper 54 Custom Classic)...  and a shooter!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2014 at 21:11
257nut View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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 i.m leaning towards the 243 ai.  is the tikka action good enough or savage { i'm lft handed}.  is the standard 22 inch barrel  good enough or would you go to a 24 or even a 26.  I just received 300  243 empty cassings from my brother today.   that kind of closed the deal. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2014 at 21:13
257nut View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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I  forgot to mention thanks for all the help
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/01/2014 at 10:38
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I don't own anything Savage, so cannot comment on them first-hand.  On Tikka, it is absolutely a great action on which to build.   It has many of the custom features found on much more expensive actions, and its design is stronger than many more common actions.
On barrel length, more length is more velocity with the same pressure, so it is your decision.  Mine sports a 22" barrel, but is suppressed.  Had I not been shooting suppressed, I would probably do 24 at least.  

I am a huge fan of the 6mm bullets for accuracy, it isn't my "go to" gun for hunting, but I hunt under special circumstances.  The Berger hybrid 105s are my favorite - and my gun's too, which is nice.

If you decide to go the 243AI route, I'd consider a neck sizing die and be done.  Once fire formed, since you probably won't have any other 243AI and probably shoot with no one that has a 243AI, keeping brass straight for that gun will be easy.  Since the AI is better for brass life, no need to stress it by FL sizing each time.

Good luck, let us know how it goes.

And Tikka did make lefty actions in 308, not sure if they still do.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/02/2014 at 12:35
257nut View Drop Down
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does anyone have any experience with e.r. shaw.  for $975 they can build a left handed  rifle in 243ai in 26 inch barrel.  it takes about one year.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/02/2014 at 14:21
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That sounds like an incredibly low price for a semi-custom rifle, are you sure the $975 is all in for a complete rifle?

I have heard of Shaw but don't think I own anything of theirs.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2014 at 10:20
257nut View Drop Down
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the rifle I requested a quote on was a left handed  240 weatherby with a 26 inch barrel, black matted finuish synthetic stock they build them on a savage 10/110 action.  they came back with a price of 960 plus shipping.  you go to build a rifle on their site.  some of their calibers are 243ai and 25/06 ai and I think 7mm/08ai. it takes almost one year to finish.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2014 at 10:45
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The reason ER Shaw is able to offer their "custom" rifles so inexpensively is because they're basing it off of Savage actions. Not only are the actions themselves inexpensive; this also allows them to use a barrel nut for headspace control. This is a much less costly and less time-consuming approach to barrel installation and headspace control vs. the traditional method of turning down a shank and facing a thread shoulder to establish headspace.

This in addition to the fact their barrels are less expensive than other custom barrel makers.
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