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2012 razor hd

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/15/2012 at 22:05
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Does any one have any input or review of new razor hd in 10x and how it compares to Zeiss FL?
Will use mostly for hunting. Thank you.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/17/2012 at 03:28
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No contest the Zeiss is better.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/17/2012 at 20:46
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The brand new Razor HD in 10x is getting excellent field reviews.  I know someone who has both and really prefers the Razor.
 
Take that for what its worth, I am still trying to get my hands on the new Razors.  I have seen the FLs many times, and think they are awesome.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/06/2013 at 21:39
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Meopta HD is better glass for the money. Brighter and clearer image in m opinion.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 09:06
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 I looked through them for a while at the DSC show this past weekend.  Albeit indoors, I tried to look in all the shadowed nooks and crannies of the building which was the worst light I could find indoors.  The razor HD is very nice, but comes in at a very bad price point.  For my $1200 or less there are several options better IMO. I agree with Esquire on the Meopta HD being a better package, the Conquest HD at $1000 is too.  With the intro of the new Zeiss HT, the FL can be found at great discounts.  I was blown away by a newer, tweaked Kowa Genesis Prominar 10x44.  It is as clear, bright, and sharp as anything in the building, i.e. SV's, FL's, SLC Hd's, etc. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 10:34
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Razor HD is a very nice binocular, although the Victory FL will be better.

I just wrapped up with testing a 8x42 Razor HD and walked away rather impressed.  It is, however, at a difficult price point since there are a lot of strong competitors there.

Steiner and Meopta are a little cheaper and very competitive.  Between the Steiner Nighthunter and Razor HD (I had them side by side), I liked the Razor a little more, but Steiner is cheaper.

If you go up in price, you run into other nice options.  Another binocular I had on hand was a new Leica Trinovid which costs a bit under $1500, I think.  To be honest, it was notably better than both the Razor HD and the Steiner Nighthunter.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 14:53
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I can tell you the "tweaked coatings" version of the Kowa Genesis 10x44 is spectacular.  Not sure when they tweaked them, but this one is noticeably better than the Genesis I had 3 years ago.  I picked at the Leica people over their paltry 10 year warranty on demo and used.  They looked at me like a dog looking at a yo-yo..........and had no answer or excuse at all.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 15:36
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Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

I can tell you the "tweaked coatings" version of the Kowa Genesis 10x44 is spectacular.  Not sure when they tweaked them, but this one is noticeably better than the Genesis I had 3 years ago.  I picked at the Leica people over their paltry 10 year warranty on demo and used.  They looked at me like a dog looking at a yo-yo..........and had no answer or excuse at all.  

I do not have much use with 10x binos, so most of my experience is with lower magnification models.  I looked at a 8.5x44 Genesis and thought it was excellent.

As for Leica warranty, I never cared about warranty one way or the other.  In Leica's case, I do not recall anyone ever complaining about their service.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 15:55
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Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:



As for Leica warranty, I never cared about warranty one way or the other.  In Leica's case, I do not recall anyone ever complaining about their service.

ILya

You've got to be kidding.  It's a constant bitch session amongst the hunting forums.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 16:27
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I used Leica's customer service and it was excellent for me.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 16:57
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Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:



As for Leica warranty, I never cared about warranty one way or the other.  In Leica's case, I do not recall anyone ever complaining about their service.

ILya

You've got to be kidding.  It's a constant bitch session amongst the hunting forums.  

I am not kidding.

I know it is a constant bitch session and I can never figure out why.

The basic situation is that the way a warranty is written (by almost anyone) is that the company does not have to do jack if they do not feel like it.

Hence, I care greatly about how well the company supports its customers.  Since the actual warranty work is entirely discretionary, the company's commitment to the customer is key.  What the warranty card actually says is irrelevant.

Considering how long Leica has been around and what people say about its customer service, I am not concerned.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 19:06
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Put it this way.  When you think of customer service, you think of Swarovski, and Leupold, and evidently Vortex.  Leica doesn't even make the top 10.  Leica's CS is hit and miss at best.  Too many confirmations out there.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 20:23
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I haven't had the new Razor HD side by side with the Victory FL.  I agree with Koshkin in that the FL is likely to be better.  Going from memory, the FL will seem brighter.  This will come from two directions.  First the Victory FL has a very high light transmission figure, some 92-93%.  This will be brighter than the Razor HD which is (I think around 90-91%).  I think it is debatable as to whether or not most human eyes can tell that difference.  The degree of apparent brightness that will be evident to the user will be in the much cooler, blue biased color bias of the Zeiss FL image.

The more valid Zeiss vs Razor HD comparison is with the new Conquest HD.  The new Conquest has a percentage or two less overall light transmission than the Victory FL.  According to Zeiss the transmission levels in the Conquest still exceed 90%.  How close the figures are to the FL I don't know.  The new Conquest HD has a less traditional blue biased, cool, bright Zeiss like image than found in the FL.  It won't likely seem as bright as the FL, but again I'm shooting from memory here, so I don't stake a lot of absolute faith in my recollections.

The thing overall is the Razor HD is at a sort of a between a rock and a hard place as regards pricing.  The Razor HD is about $1,270 and the new Conquest HD is about $300 cheaper.  It will be arguable which one is overall the better binocular, but personally my money goes to the Conquest.  $300 is $300 in my outlook.  For $1,200 the HD is going to be looked at as competition for the likes of the new Leica Trinovid.  I think Zeiss and Leica likely win the name game.  It would be a different issue if the Razor was at the same price level as the Conquest HD.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 20:51
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Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:



As for Leica warranty, I never cared about warranty one way or the other.  In Leica's case, I do not recall anyone ever complaining about their service.

ILya

You've got to be kidding.  It's a constant bitch session amongst the hunting forums.  

I am not kidding.

I know it is a constant bitch session and I can never figure out why.

The basic situation is that the way a warranty is written (by almost anyone) is that the company does not have to do jack if they do not feel like it.

Hence, I care greatly about how well the company supports its customers.  Since the actual warranty work is entirely discretionary, the company's commitment to the customer is key.  What the warranty card actually says is irrelevant.

Considering how long Leica has been around and what people say about its customer service, I am not concerned.

ILya
Ilya:
 
The complaints about Leica service, concerns pre-owned or second owner.  Their warranty does
not transfer like the others mentioned, including Swaro. Zeiss, Nikon, and Vortex.
 
That is a big issue with many optics users.  Now you know.
 
Jerry
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 21:06
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I actually think warranty is a big deal.  I just used Swarovski's customer service, and they went by the word of their warranty.  It was good service, but Vortex' warranty is better.  When you travel the rough parts of the world with your gear, stuff can happen, and it is nice to have that "no fault" warranty there if you need it.
 
I have had great customer service from Meopta as well.  I am completing my evaluation of the Meostar HD 10X42, and they are not going back to Meopta.  They are superior in image quality to my Swarovski SLC neus.  They just are.  They are $1000, and are a true value.
 
I had them right next to the conquest HDs, and the Meoptas are superior in that comparison as well, but this time more in "robustness" of build, and eyecup design (this is some personal preference, but a big difference to me). 
 
Optically, the Meopta HDs have outstanding contrast and subsequently have excellent color saturation.
 
I think when it comes to binoculars anywhere near $1000, the Meoptas should be given a first look.
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/07/2013 at 21:14
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Also, the only chink in the FL's armor is edge softness.  It is not bothersome to me, but to some it keeps them looking at other options.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/08/2013 at 11:10
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Sounds like the Meopta HD is a winner.  So's the Zeiss Conquest HD.  Maybe the sales of uber expensive stuff has been flat for awhile and has spurred some innovation, or at least some change in thinking (on Zeiss part anyway).  The $1,000-1,200 stuff is now a LOT closer to the high end than it used to be.  I have not seen the Meopta HD yet, but I have seen the Conquest and Razor.  Anybody who thinks that they can get much better is suffering from preconceived notions I think.
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